President Biden

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Originally Posted by Guisslapp

What is more disgusting is the idea that one thinks giving money might actually work. That is a disgusting proposition, because it means that you would be hoping to overturn people’s votes (the will of the people) in favor of the state government picking their own slate of electors.

Just because you aren’t happy with an election result is a poor excuse to try to destroy our democratic traditions. It is unAmerican.

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Well, I've tried to stick to the results argument here because (as discussed above) we don't really know anyone's intent. I'm willing to assume that most of the Trump team realizes that this stuff isn't going to work (and I think there is some evidence to back that assertion up). And I'm quite sure that most Republican congressional members know, but are keeping quiet to avoid turning Trump and the base against themselves. I think many of the media on the far right probably know, but they're financially motivated to keep the facade up (actually, the article I read about OAN/Newsmax did say that most of the hosts at least kind of hedge, but are happy to let their guests say any wild thing they want without correction - which is probably smart cover, but pretty cynical).

There are kind of four possibilities here:

1. Biden won fairly (obviously a vote here or a vote there on both sides probably fraudulent, but nothing close to large enough, nothing systematic, maybe worth sussing out for posterity's sake or to reform for the future, but by the rules - Biden won).
2. Biden won but it was unfair enough that if enough is uncovered, then enough states flip and Trump could (legally) be president. I guess in this case, Trump really should have won. And therefore it's important to give money to make sure this happens.
3. Biden won "fair enough" to really be the winner per the rules, but with the right legal approach that can be changed (unfairly - if possibly legally if you squint enough). Trump didn't really win per the rules, but if the rules get bent, we can make it happen.
4. Biden probably won, but Trump might have won if we examine everything closely, willing to trust the courts, just want as many possible re-examinations as possible.

I think if you really buy scenario #2 or #4 as I assume most donors are, it's admirable to donate (if you really think he won, sure, fight for your boy).

I just think most of those profiting off of the donations fall into either #1 or #3. I really don't know about the man himself. I think he might fit in any of the 4 or some new grouping.

And yeah, #3 is pretty disgusting.

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Originally Posted by Guisslapp

Trump is stress testing our election system right now (and the idea of democracy, in general). It isn’t working, but harm is being done.

The Supreme Court (and lower courts for that matter) have made it clear in they are going to try to protect what makes America.

Shows how absolutely it was to ever trust this maniac with the power of the executive branch.

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Mail in ballots 90% Biden, but ONLY in the swing states. Nothing to see here. Bad Orange man in tearing down the great system that allows this to happen.

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Originally Posted by PawDawg

Mail in ballots 90% Biden, but ONLY in the swing states. Nothing to see here. Bad Orange man in tearing down the great system that allows this to happen.

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You keep promoting that false statement but it is not true.

In Pennsylvania, Biden won 75% of the mail in vote. So why do you lie?

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.inq...outputType=amp

Remember, Trump told his supporters to not vote by mail in rallies in these states, so is it really any surprise that they didn’t?

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Originally Posted by Guisslapp

You keep promoting that false statement but it is not true.

In Pennsylvania, Biden won 75% of the mail in vote. So why do you lie?

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.inq...outputType=amp

Remember, Trump told his supporters to not vote by mail in rallies in these states, so is it really any surprise that they didn’t?

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Trump got more votes in Penn that he got it 2016. That's really all he needed to do to win Penn. The lies you are part of claim 10s of thousands more voted for Biden than voted for Clinton in 2016...all by mail of course.

Don’t know the exact number in GA, but here it says that Biden got nearly twice as much absentee vote as Trump. That is not even close to 90 percent.

https://apnews.com/article/election-...8609781fe78a18

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Originally Posted by inudesu

In case it isn't clear, that point has been conceded. Spend your money how you like, my advice (which you can take or not as you like) is that this particular way of spending your money is unlikely to get the result you are seeking, but if you disagree or don't care about the end result (are not giving your money predicated on an expectation of Trump necessarily winning) or if you are 50/50 but think there is just the slightest chance that it might pay off -by all means. I cannot tell you how to spend your money. But in the (very mild) vein of "hey guys, you should buy this book, it's great" or "don't buy a ticket for this movie, it stinks" sense of suggesting what will probably happen should you spend your money in a certain way - and in that sense only - I think this is a poor investment, because I think there is no case here, the election was legal, the legal challenges will (continue to) fail, and Biden will be president.

And then, yeah. Some governmental policies will go a different way from what you (and often I) would prefer. That's for sure.

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If ever your advice is important to me, I'll be sure to let you know.

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Originally Posted by Guisslapp

Don’t know the exact number in GA, but here it says that Biden got nearly twice as much absentee vote as Trump. That is not even close to 90 percent.

https://apnews.com/article/election-...8609781fe78a18

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The point remains that Trump got more votes than he did in 2016 in every swing state. Biden just happened to get more votes that Clinton in every one of those states, but not the others..ALL by mail in ballots.

Nothing to see here, it's all on the up an up.

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Originally Posted by Cal&Ken

If ever your advice is important to me, I'll be sure to let you know.

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It's worth very little, but if you let me know I'll be happy to share it.

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Originally Posted by PawDawg

The point remains that Trump got more votes than he did in 2016 in every swing state. Biden just happened to get more votes that Clinton in every one of those states, but not the others..ALL by mail in ballots.

Nothing to see here, it's all on the up an up.

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More people voted.

https://www.nbcnews.com/politics/202...ction-n1249620

Naturally Biden would do better in mail in votes. How much better before it gets suspicious would be a pretty high number for me given the circumstances. Doesn't seem to be a sticking point for the local officials. I mean, in Georgia they counted the votes like 3 times.

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Originally Posted by PawDawg

The point remains that Trump got more votes than he did in 2016 in every swing state. Biden just happened to get more votes that Clinton in every one of those states, but not the others..ALL by mail in ballots.

Nothing to see here, it's all on the up an up.

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Another bogus fake fact from you. Biden got 3 million more votes than Hillary in CA. He got 2 million more votes than Hillary in Texas.

Where are you getting all these fake facts from?

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Originally Posted by Guisslapp

What is more disgusting is the idea that one thinks giving money might actually work. That is a disgusting proposition, because it means that you would be hoping to overturn people’s votes (the will of the people) in favor of the state government picking their own slate of electors.

Just because you aren’t happy with an election result is a poor excuse to try to destroy our democratic traditions. It is unAmerican.

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You just listed the exact blueprint of the socialist Dems, and yours, last 4 years!!!!!!
How typical double standard of you my man!

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Originally Posted by Guisslapp

Another bogus fake fact from you. Biden got 3 million more votes than Hillary in CA. He got 2 million more votes than Hillary in Texas.

Where are you getting all these fake facts from?

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Great examples. A state full of idiots that will require a bail out and a purple state gaining more and more of those idiots everyday.

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Originally Posted by PawDawg

Great examples. A state full of idiots that will require a bail out and a purple state gaining more and more of those idiots everyday.

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Admit it. You were wrong.

https://www.nationalreview.com/corne...-state-cities/

Gateway Pundit (and the like) just spread misinformation.

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Originally Posted by Guisslapp

Admit it. You were wrong.

https://www.nationalreview.com/corne...-state-cities/

Gateway Pundit (and the like) just spread misinformation.

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My point all along has been that the swing states made the difference with mail in ballots. You don't believe that all the stars aligned perfectly to make this happen. I know you say you do, but you don't.

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Originally Posted by PawDawg

My point all along has been that the swing states made the difference with mail in ballots. You don't believe that all the stars aligned perfectly to make this happen. I know you say you do, but you don't.

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The stars didn’t align perfect. This wasn’t a narrow electoral college win or narrow popular vote win. This was not a surprise win. The margins were greater than in 2016 in the states other than Georgia.

Democrats historically win the mail in vote. Trump told his people to vote in person in rallies in these swing states. Democrats told pollsters before the election that they planned to vote by mail.

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.for...publicans/amp/

This election wasn’t a surprise to anyone other than Trump supporters who feast only on right wing media.

We knew the mail in vote would be counted AFTER the in person vote, so we knew that Trump’s leads at the beginning of the count didn’t mean he would be on top when they finished the count.