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I know you are of the opinion that's it's too late and won't matter at this point, but I still believe -as I posted on 2/26 - that flights from countries like South Korea, Japan, and Italy should have been suspended beginning last weekend. The second case in Washington is of a woman who came in from Seoul.Quote:
Originally Posted by Guisslapp
First death in Washington state.
It MAY have slowed it getting here, but odds are it was already here by the time the outbreak was discovered in South Korea. We would have to essentially stop all freedom of movement if we really wanted to make a difference, because it is quickly going everywhere.Quote:
Originally Posted by The Historian
Chasing the outbreak in Washington state. 2 more positive tests and some firefighters in quarantine.
https://www.king5.com/mobile/article...c-a337b27de567
https://www.bioworld.com/articles/43...-and-infodemic
You can follow Trevor Bedford on Twitter.
Based on genetic sequencing of the Washington state cases against the genetic sequences of other COVID-19 samples from around the world, it is probable that Washington State has had an outbreak going for up to 6 weeks.
On the question of a vaccine. Since over 30,000 people have had, and survived, this virus, can't a vaccine be made from their blood samples? I have to look this up...that is, how vaccines are made. But, I'm still on my first cup of coffee this morning. Maybe later.
I think you are talking about antiserum.Quote:
Originally Posted by dawg80
Gilead’s drug remdesivir, which is used to treat Ebola, is being trialed presently in China and maybe even the US. I think they are in phase 3. My understanding is that they are only using the drug as a therapeutic right now and not a prophylactic.
Moderna also has a drug that is in phase 1.
Was just browsing the CDC website...it's beyond my pay grade. Three ways to create vaccines, including using chicken eggs. Cool stuff. COVID-19 is another "coronavirus," as were SARS and MERS. So! according to those in-the-know, our scientists already well on their way to developing a vaccine for 19. Drugmaker Johnson & Johnson may be a mere few months away from having one, according to one source. Of course, no matter how fast a 19 vaccine can be developed, and then deployed, this current outbreak would have run its course, damage done.
Yeah, an "antiserum" right. Made from those who have contracted and then beaten a virus. That would be helpful too, I think.
When I was returning from a trip to Europe, back in 2013, I caught "the flu." I mean, it was bad. Fever hit 104F. My doctor later told me the regular flu shot everyone gets each year would not have helped me in that situation. My strain of the flu virus hailed from sub-Sahara Africa, is VERY rare, and as such is not included in the annual flu shot vaccine.
So, there appears to be no "catch all, end all" way to combat these virus outbreaks. The only way is EXTREME world wide monitoring to identify and isolate, as quickly as possible, such outbreaks. And that means EXTREME curtailment of travel. Sorry, all you bleeding hearts who will scream "racism!" Can't have it both ways.
We are well past the point where closing travel would make any difference.
I meant in the future. For future breakouts of contagious diseases. And, even restricting travel from high risk regions of the world. Such as requiring mandatory quarantine regulations. Won't happen because of cries of racism.Quote:
Originally Posted by Blue Dawg
The travel restriction isn’t as important as the outbreak countries on “social distancing” efforts.
What would help is to have a permanent epidemic monitoring and command group inside the White House National Security Council (NSC) and another in the Department of Homeland Security (DHS)—both of which followed the scientific and public health leads of the National Institutes of Health (NIH) and the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention (CDC) and the diplomatic advice of the State Department. Kind of like what we had up until 2018.
Also would help not to cut the funding of the global health section of the CDC by 80% like we did.
Discouraging folks from eating bats monkey brains and rats would be a good start to helping the situation.
Also, having Congress act in a responsible manner instead of focusing on overturning elections that have long passed would also be nice. They could have been helping with this issue, but chose to focus on political BS instead.
True. And when most of your industrial supply chain goes through countries with high levels of infection, it's kind of difficult to just close the door.Quote:
Originally Posted by Blue Dawg
2 now, in fewer than 100 cases.Quote:
Originally Posted by HogDawg
Yeah, someone else posted this possible fact when it served their narrative that the virus was already here and spreading rapidly. This, of course, means that untold numbers of people have already been infected and likely recovered.Quote:
Originally Posted by TYLERTECHSAS
Naturally, when the desire of that same person was to show how deadly the virus was, only the sub 100 number was used to further that idea.
Logical consistency has never been this poster's strong point.
It is my understanding that most people get this virus and think they have nothing but a mild flu or a common cold...then they get better. If you are older (like me) or have a compromised immune system (not like me as far as I know) it can get much worse leading to sepsis and multiple organ failure, or pneumonia.
No, I am perfectly consistent on this. I bet we have at least a thousand cases already here. The death toll will rise. There are quite a few others in critical condition in Washington already. There is a delay in being infected and dying - the first Washington death was believed to have contracted the disease several weeks prior.
The ones that have been diagnosed so far fit one of three criteria: (1) recent travel to a country of outbreak, (2) contacted a known carrier, or (3) have severe respiratory illness.
Those are the ONLY people being tested right now.
The point is that we don’t have better options for treating those that have severe reaction to this disease, and that number has been close to 10 percent globally, with around 2 percent not recovering.
Notice how WND and Washington Examiner don’t actually deny this part:Quote:
Originally Posted by TYLERTECHSAS
https://web.archive.org/web/20200206...ease-outbreak/
Some schools in Washington are closing for a day to do a teacher in-service around remote teaching.
Earlier in the year, a number of schools were closed for a week here in Tennessee because of the flu.Quote:
Originally Posted by Guisslapp
6 have died in Washington now.
The folks in that same nursing home are falling fast.Quote:
Originally Posted by Guisslapp
Doctor Radio opines that more than 100,000 in US have or have had Covid-19 since 01/01/2020 with more than 80% be asymptomatic and that the very old (>90) and the compromised and untreated for the compromised condition will be the hardest hit demographic.
But Pawdawg assured us it couldn’t happen here.Quote:
Originally Posted by TYLERTECHSAS
No I didn't. I've already told you I was referring to your statement about how understaffed we were when you compared our medical care (intensive care) to China.Quote:
Originally Posted by Guisslapp
Are these people dying in the US ever even making it to intensive care?
Yes, almost all of them are being treated at the same hospital (EvergreenHealth in Kirkland).Quote:
Originally Posted by PawDawg
I never said we were understaffed, but we might not have enough ICU beds in communities that get hit.
ICU beds can be increased if needed. Not in China though. Are those dying here even being admitted to ICU? I’m guessing no
My daughter is an neuro ICU nurse at Parkland hospital here in Dallas. She said that they have "negative pressure" isolation rooms on her floor, that would receive patients suspected of coronavirus. There are 3 other ICU groups that would also potentially receive patients. She's a little nervous, but I told her that if they cannot contain the spread of the virus once it hits the hospital with all of their infectious protocols, then there is no hope for rest of us.
ETA: They currently don't have anyone with the virus.
King County, Washington is buying a motel and converting mobile units they procured for homeless to help with isolation.
Isolation is not ICU. Not even close.Quote:
Originally Posted by Guisslapp
I didn’t say it was. I was just posting the latest news tidbits.Quote:
Originally Posted by PawDawg
Media Panic Is The Problem
https://www.foxnews.com/media/dr-dre...-the-contagion
Fed cuts rates...market gives back most of Monday's gains.
10 year treasury dropped below 1 percent.Quote:
Originally Posted by johnnylightnin
If it weren’t for the media attention, people might not be going to the same effort to contain the spread of it.Quote:
Originally Posted by TYLERTECHSAS
In Snohomish/King counties, 27 have tested positive, 9 have died.
There was also a guy that travelled to work in Manhattan that has a case (of unknown origin). Seems near unavoidable that NYC, along with all other major cities, should have an outbreak.
BSQuote:
Originally Posted by Guisslapp
now there's an intelligent responseQuote:
Originally Posted by TYLERTECHSAS
”Thank you. Thank you very much!”Quote:
Originally Posted by Champ967
More on the outbreak in NYC.
6 people identified, 1critical.
https://www.nbcnewyork.com/news/loca...lowTwt_NYBrand
I don’t know how you contain the spread in NYC with all the crowds and public transportation.
California has had their first C19 death and the WAC has cancelled some basketball games.
39 and 10 now.Quote:
Originally Posted by Guisslapp
CDC is now letting people get tested based on doctors order and not limited to the three prior classes of patients.
If only somebody like Biden or Burnie had been in charge...
Not everything is about politics.Quote:
Originally Posted by PawDawg
Ya mean like Biden was kind of in charge, behind obummer in 2009, when they did nothing to stem the Swine Flu pandemic and 18,036 Americans died! That kind of "in charge"? That lasted from April, 2009 until August, 2010. But, oh, of course! it was all Trump's fault! (probably were still blaming Bush for their own failings, actually)Quote:
Originally Posted by PawDawg
Right. You've done a 180 in this thread. From doomsday to this. It was all Trumps fault to "not everything is about politics".Quote:
Originally Posted by Guisslapp
I don’t know where you get your false information (Facebook, I assume), but you have inflated the US deaths from H1N1 by at least 50 percent.Quote:
Originally Posted by dawg80
As far as the US (and world) response, here is the timeline.
https://www.cdc.gov/flu/pandemic-res...-timeline.html
You sound like you are afflicted with TDS. Where did I blame this on Trump?Quote:
Originally Posted by PawDawg
Trump may have only hurt our ability to respond to these sorts of things by getting rid of our pandemic response team and by misleading people about the inevitability of US communities being infected. But I don’t know how that could have changed the course of how things have gone so far (unless the pandemic response team could have more quickly engaged China to SLOW the spread and potentially identify people who had travelled from China in the relevant time period quickly enough to isolate and test them). Maybe it would have made no difference.
Communities that are affected by outbreaks of C19 are responding aggressively to isolate actual and suspected carriers of the virus. People are working remote, schools are closing, conferences are being cancelled. All of these steps will help reduce the spread of this disease.
FB and MSFT are asking people to work from home. Some schools in the area are being closed for 2 weeks.
I just Googled "Swine Flu break out 2009" and several websites popped up with numbers close to the 18K. As for that number, I admit, I thought it sounded high because I don't remember much panic from back then. Of course the lamestream media would have been covering it up to protect obummer who fumbled the ball.Quote:
Originally Posted by Guisslapp
That was worldwide. Not just Americans. But it is hard to argue that the administration did anything wrong in its response.Quote:
Originally Posted by dawg80
We have some C19 positive cases in the Houston area now.
Just came back from a short work trip. SHV to ATL to PHL, and took an Amtrak to DC. I was surprised with how little is being done in airports and other public transit to help. I would've thought there would at least be some banks of hand sanitizer set up. It seemed to be business as usual.
The media and some others have blown this way out of proportion, according to several of my doctor friends. One said think of it as the Hong Kong flu that was supposed to make us all sick in the late 70's...except this time maybe more people will catch it.
It's a new virus...a novel virus...we have limited resistance to it...and that's what makes it scarier than it should be.
It is very dangerous for you boomers. Did you see what it did for that skilled nursing facility in Kirkland, WA? Brutal death rate there.
The isolation and social distancing efforts being made in areas of outbreak may make the total infection/death counts lower than other epidemics. But if that happens, it will only be BECAUSE people take the steps that you guys are calling an over-reaction.
Apparently you don’t know what a skilled nursing facility does. You know those people are/were already very sick right?Nothing says they were boomersQuote:
Originally Posted by Guisslapp
A little over a week since the first US diagnosis and we are at 442 known cases with only about 2000 tests administered. Our major business and transportation hubs are some of the earliest spots of noted outbreaks.
Actually, they are reporting the ages, that is how I know they are boomers.Quote:
Originally Posted by PawDawg
We know most have “underlying” health conditions, but it is non-specific for obvious privacy reasons.
You never miss a chance to throw shade on boomers. They are a huge demographic in a small setting of sick people. Which propaganda rag gave you this brilliant deduction?Quote:
Originally Posted by Guisslapp
It is very dangerous for you boomers. Did you see what it did for that skilled nursing facility in Kirkland, WA? Brutal death rate there.
I am not reading “propaganda rags”. I am getting all my info from local reporting - king5 news. Do you not believe that heart disease, diabetes, COPD, etc also has a strong age correlation?Quote:
Originally Posted by PawDawg
These skilled nursing homes are not full of Gen X and millennials.
It’s not dangerous for boomers. Those susceptible to this and flu are defined by a variety things other than age span. The most common are elderly AND poor health. Otherwise it is far from lethal.
Hope your blood pressure is all good.Quote:
Originally Posted by PawDawg
Hypertension is a risk factor with C19.
Not if treated. Untreated HBP is always a riskQuote:
Originally Posted by Guisslapp
You should watch the daily press conferences. Then you would have known that controlled hypertension is not a material risk factor.Quote:
Originally Posted by Guisslapp
Unless you’re trying to spread fear and panic, and hoping there’s a crisis so you can blame Trump.
It isn’t that simple.Quote:
Originally Posted by PawDawg
https://www.nature.com/articles/s41569-020-0360-5
Quote:
Angiotensin-converting enzyme 2 (ACE2) is a membrane-bound aminopeptidase that has a vital role in the cardiovascular and immune systems4. ACE2 is involved in heart function and the development of hypertension and diabetes mellitus. In addition, ACE2 has been identified as a functional receptor for coronaviruses4, including SARS-CoV and SARS-CoV-2. SARS-CoV-2 infection is triggered by binding of the spike protein of the virus to ACE2, which is highly expressed in the heart and lungs4. SARS-CoV-2 mainly invades alveolar epithelial cells, resulting in respiratory symptoms. These symptoms are more severe in patients with CVD, which might be associated with increased secretion of ACE2 in these patients compared with healthy individuals. ACE2 levels can be increased by the use of renin–angiotensin–aldosterone system inhibitors. Given that ACE2 is a functional receptor for SARS-CoV-2, the safety and potential effects of antihypertension therapy with ACE inhibitors or angiotensin-receptor blockers in patients with COVID-19 should be carefully considered. Whether patients with COVID-19 and hypertension who are taking an ACE inhibitor or angiotensin-receptor blocker should switch to another antihypertensive drug remains controversial, and further evidence is required.
Which expert are you talking about? I am following this closer than most.Quote:
Originally Posted by glm47
The USA has lost over 20,000 to the regular flu bugs already in these first 2 short months of 2020. The Covid 19 is just another flu started and expanded by yet another lying arse commie, political system in China. Socialist, communist and 3rd world nations start this crappola.
And Trump was right when he wanted to shut down our borders to illegals and countries that hate America.
Well, seems to me if we are to accept all the cries of anguish from the left over this Covid-19 crisis, we'd get across the board support for closing (controlling) our borders and other points of entry. But...we won't see that. Instead, we'll see libtards screaming for MORE and MORE action on stopping this virus, cries of "the Trump administration needs to do more!" And at the same time saying...Oh, but we have to have open borders and unchecked immigration so folks from just anywhere can come here.
Ya can't make this stuff up...
What do you mean by “closing our borders”? Do you mean stopping immigration in its entirety? If so, do you realize what that would do the economy?Quote:
Originally Posted by dawg80
What Trump needs/needed to do was: (1) make sure that communities get their testing kits weeks ago to help manage the spread and health care response, (2) direct his administration to provide financial guardrails for the communities impacted, and (3) provide a consistent message across the highest levels of government that is also consistent with the science regarding C19.
He has failed on all 3 critical accounts.
Closing the border to China was a patch that would have only worked if he would have also made sure that he did the 3 critical things above. Instead, it appears that he relied on that as the primary solution.
Take a breath. Don't let it get to you. You're getting silly again.Quote:
Originally Posted by Guisslapp
We have begun making arrangements just in case there is some business interruption. This week will be my last week of travel for a bit. The good news is so far C19 isn't living up to the hype besides the business impact aspect. Lets hope that is all it is.
Your post is missing the James Earl Jones "THIS IS CNN" voiceover.Quote:
Originally Posted by Guisslapp
Once again, you have proven yourself gullible and easily led (and controlled). Congrats.
Actually I meant closing the borders/controlling the borders in the short term until this scare passes, and controlling the borders going forward as many of us have advocated since Covid-19 was a mere puppy, isolated in China.Quote:
Originally Posted by Guisslapp
And here ya go again (no surprise) with your bad case of TDS clouding your mind. You said: Trump needed to make sure test kits reached communities... I can see it now.
Local healthcare official: We're waiting on President Trump to deliver us test kits.
Reporter: Well, where is he now?
Local healthcare official: Last I heard he was still delivering in Virginia, with North Carolina next...
Reporter: Ya mean he is having to deliver them all personally?
Local healthcare official: Yep! Some goofball in Texas says it is strictly Trump's responsibility to deliver the test kits. So he is driving the delivery truck doing just that.
You do realize that until very recently, the CDC was the only one allowed to do C19 testing in the US and their first kits were faulty, right? Incompetence from the top.Quote:
Originally Posted by dawg80
https://www.sciencemag.org/news/2020...y-soon-improve
With increases in testing we'll see an increase in cases in the next few weeks. Decision makers aren't going to take chances.
I'll be interested to see if the NCAA tournament is played in front of fans or in empty arenas. And at what point do schools in various areas start to close? I was hoping this could be contained until warmer weather arrived and school ended in May in the south and early June in the north.
You can sing "Covid Nineteen" to the tune of "Come On Eileen"
You're welcome.
M m m My CoronaQuote:
Originally Posted by Champ967
ooh nice!Quote:
Originally Posted by DawgyNWindow
Louisiana is on the board.
https://www.nola.com/news/coronaviru...c2b68ccd5.html
Forgive the language, but it's the f u c king flu! Get over it already!
One of your dumber posts. And that is saying something.Quote:
Originally Posted by CARTEK
I assume Gomer's reply is to my post...I blocked him months ago and refuse to unblock him now. My kids unblock him sometimes to get a laugh.
Tell him not to buy into the MEDIA TERRORISM...it'll just keep his little paranoid self up at night!
From the highly authoritative Facebook, which this time is spot on:
Covid-19* is causing mass hysteria, but thousands of unknown and unvaccinated illegals crossing the southern border doesn't...things that make you go, "hummmm!"
* it's a virus just like the damn flu
"incompetence from the top" on faulty kits. Right! because we all know that Donald Trump was left alone in a big warehouse and expected to pack all the kits himself, and to make sure they all were working properly. :icon_roll:Quote:
Originally Posted by Guisslapp
What about Steely Dan's "Hey Nineteen...skate a little lower now."Quote:
Originally Posted by Champ967
Why did he put us in the position where only the CDC could make kits?Quote:
Originally Posted by dawg80
Why wasn’t there more urgency to push these kits out earlier (such as when he stopped travel from China)?
How come all the other developed countries are doing more tests than us?
Incompetence. Failure of leadership. Inattentiveness to detail. Failure to appoint competent people in roles of authority. Failure to distinguish between hope and reality.
I'm not sure why I continue to waste my time with you...wait! yes I do, it's fun!
Bureaucrats run the government. They do everything. I know, I used to work for the government. Quick example, when Hurricane Katrina was bearing down on New Orleans my organization had already made arrangements, plans, and had taken all necessary steps to provide services. Three days later then prez, George W. Bush, declared a national disaster. We had been providing services for better than 24 hrs by then. Point is, we knew our jobs and didn't wait for anyone.
If Covid-19 is running amuck it's not Trump's fault. Those who KNEW they were gonna be on the frontlines dropped the ball. You will keep on blaming Trump because of your bad case of TDS. But, it doesn't change the real truth. Which by the way = the facts. Unlike your boy Biden who says he wants the "truth" not "the facts." :icon_roll:
How does Katrina apply to the current situation? You obviously didn’t read the article from Science that I posted so, I will direct you to one of the key parts:Quote:
Originally Posted by dawg80
So this begs, the question, does Trump and his appointees not understand how things work? Where I am from, that is known as “incompetence.”Quote:
In principle, many hospital and academic labs around the country have the capability to carry out tests themselves. The PCR reaction uses so-called primers, short stretches of DNA, to find viral sequences. The CDC website posts the primers used in its test, and WHO publicly catalogs other primers and protocols, too. Well-equipped state or local labs can use these—or come up with their own—to produce what are known as a “laboratory-developed tests” for in-house use.
But at the moment, they’re not allowed to do that without FDA approval. When the United States declared the outbreak a public health emergency on 31 January, a bureaucratic process kicked in that requires FDA’s “emergency use approval” for any tests. “The declaration of a public health emergency did exactly what it shouldn’t have. It limited the diagnostic capacity of this country,” Mina says. “It’s insane.”
On 24 February, APHL asked FDA Commissioner Stephen Hahn for “enforcement discretion” to sidestep the emergency process and allow APHL members labs to use their own tests. On 26 February, Hahn replied that the CDC test could be modified to use just the primers that specifically detect SARS-CoV-2, essentially ignoring the faulty portion of the kits. FDA, in other words, would look the other way to make more widespread testing possible.
So Congress was briefed back in January about the Coronavirus, however they were preoccupied with Trump's impeachment and couldn't be bothered. Now they(and Goosey) are saying Trump is completely unprepared and inept. But fear not, this week the House is going to vote to further restrict the President's ability to stop/ban people coming to the country from countries. They did not like it when he banned people from China or Italy from coming into the country, yet screech that Trump is incompetent. The democrats really don't care about average Americans. They want power any ANY cost. They are dangerous!!
Truth!Quote:
Originally Posted by FriscoDog
But, Goosey is right about one thing: we're all gonna die. Yep, it's true.
CDC is under Trump, not Congress.Quote:
Originally Posted by FriscoDog
Travel bans reduce transparency and cooperation from the county you are banning, so that has to be considered as well. If countries know your response is to block people from traveling from their country, what is their incentive to share early information about outbreaks? Trump’s feeble mind is simply incapable of thinking more than 1 step into the future.
Unfortunately, Trump is a one trick pony. Travel bans are his tool for everything, but they don’t solve all problems. They may have delayed the outbreak, but the time that was bought was completely wasted by incompetence.
You are such a broken record that no one takes anything you say seriously. You'd criticize President Trump no matter what he did. You're nothing more than a simple stooge of left wing propaganda. People with any ability to reason at all simply tune out what people like you have to say.Quote:
Originally Posted by Guisslapp
Most folks are smart enough to realize what I said is true. Use your brain.Quote:
Originally Posted by brtransplant
Yep. Goosey, and a few others here, have ZERO credibility. Well, on anything pertaining to Trump. Goosey can be "okay" on some other matters.Quote:
Originally Posted by brtransplant
No, Guisslapp is in a category all his own.Quote:
Originally Posted by dawg80