Immigration

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TYLERTECHSAS

Not the point at all. Things like this are the point. There are correct ways to enter a sovern nation's borders and this isn't it. We are the only chumps doing this against our own laws at that!

And worse is that Obama and his ADM knew about this a long time ago and in fact encouraged it by his usual maddening lack of true American constitutional leadership. Much like his allowing thousands of Christians and minorities to be killed in the Syrian, Iraq and now the muslim/Islamic ISIS torn war/genocide (if you've been reading the real news about this since Obama was warned 9 months ago at least).

Obama Admin Released More Than 600 Illegal Immigrants With Criminal Convictions...

'Homeland Security' broke law...

---

These are children and we need to be mindful of that. Their parents were told (in their country and not by Obama) that they could escape the violence in their country by coming here. You know - sort of like our Statue of Liberty states. I agree that they are here illegally, but we need to handle it correctly. We have been very open about asking Mexico to take in these refugees for years, yet we have done nothing here. I don't know all the answers, but there is no use pointing blame at our President. We have a whole Congress that could have done something, but didn't. We have a former President that put the exception in the law. Let's do what Christian's would do and help these children and, then, address the real problem. It is not right to treat them as we would not treat our own children.

We sometimes get mixed up between law and what is right. I just picture the unfortunate circumstance of being born in one of these countries and trying to get my child out before they are killed or pulled into one of the gangs. I would do anything for my child to get out, even if it meant giving my child up. That is love, that is Christianity - putting yourself in the shoes of others. It is NOT people parading around with hateful signs and shipping children off without a chance. Let's do what is right and set an example for other countries, instead of talking out of both sides of our mouths and being hypocrites.

What may be "right" for the displaced children may not be "right" for American children or the taxpaying citizens. What may seem the right thing to do in the short term will probably have long term unintended consequences (in th parlance of our times). IMHO, immigration policy should be based on what is good for the country, not the individuals seeking to immigrate, i.e., will the immigrant be a productive citizen. Yeah, it is all warm and fuzzy to welcome people to our country, and that is my initial feeling about it. Feelings often make bad policy and law.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by stodgdog

What may be "right" for the displaced children may not be "right" for American children or the taxpaying citizens. What may seem the right thing to do in the short term will probably have long term unintended consequences (in th parlance of our times). IMHO, immigration policy should be based on what is good for the country, not the individuals seeking to immigrate, i.e., will the immigrant be a productive citizen. Yeah, it is all warm and fuzzy to welcome people to our country, and that is my initial feeling about it. Feelings often make bad policy and law.

---

That is what I am talking about. We get confused between what is right and what is policy/law. Are we going to do what is right for these children, whom are all equal to our children in the eyes of the Lord? I don't even pretend to know all the answers. I am, personally, at a loss for what is the correct action to take. I just know that too many people (adults and children) are suffering around the world and the United States needs to figure out a way to prove that we are more than just words that encourage a better life. In this case, we need to do something to ensure these children have a chance in life and are not relegated to going back and suffering - not to mention, making them and their parents potential new enemies of our country. We need to stand for helping others and prove it. Of all the things our country spends money in other countries, helping children should be #1. We need more empathy and action, than sympathy and just shipping them back.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by champion110

That is what I am talking about. We get confused between what is right and what is policy/law. Are we going to do what is right for these children, whom are all equal to our children in the eyes of the Lord? I don't even pretend to know all the answers. I am, personally, at a loss for what is the correct action to take. I just know that too many people (adults and children) are suffering around the world and the United States needs to figure out a way to prove that we are more than just words that encourage a better life. In this case, we need to do something to ensure these children have a chance in life and are not relegated to going back and suffering - not to mention, making them and their parents potential new enemies of our country. We need to stand for helping others and prove it. Of all the things our country spends money in other countries, helping children should be #1. We need more empathy and action, than sympathy and just shipping them back.

---

Absolutely. Too many people hold their politics nearly as close to their hearts as they do their religion and spirituality.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by maverick

Absolutely. Too many people hold their politics nearly as close to their hearts as they do their religion and spirituality.

---

Agree....... and sometimes they would have you do the opposite.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by champion110

These are children and we need to be mindful of that. Their parents were told (in their country and not by Obama) that they could escape the violence in their country by coming here. You know - sort of like our Statue of Liberty states. I agree that they are here illegally, but we need to handle it correctly. We have been very open about asking Mexico to take in these refugees for years, yet we have done nothing here. I don't know all the answers, but there is no use pointing blame at our President. We have a whole Congress that could have done something, but didn't. We have a former President that put the exception in the law. Let's do what Christian's would do and help these children and, then, address the real problem. It is not right to treat them as we would not treat our own children.

We sometimes get mixed up between law and what is right. I just picture the unfortunate circumstance of being born in one of these countries and trying to get my child out before they are killed or pulled into one of the gangs. I would do anything for my child to get out, even if it meant giving my child up. That is love, that is Christianity - putting yourself in the shoes of others. It is NOT people parading around with hateful signs and shipping children off without a chance. Let's do what is right and set an example for other countries, instead of talking out of both sides of our mouths and being hypocrites.

---

Obama could have done something when he had both the a Dem senate and Dem Congress but they didn't want the blame for the disaster and fallout. Obama and Holder are lying, hypocritical jokes. They have done zero right in 6 years!

---

Illegals hit jackpot with lenient U.S. judges...

Gays seek special deportation protection...


Immigrant children 'swarm' school registration center near Atlanta...

Four charged with kidnapping...

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by champion110

That is what I am talking about. We get confused between what is right and what is policy/law. Are we going to do what is right for these children, whom are all equal to our children in the eyes of the Lord? I don't even pretend to know all the answers. I am, personally, at a loss for what is the correct action to take. I just know that too many people (adults and children) are suffering around the world and the United States needs to figure out a way to prove that we are more than just words that encourage a better life. In this case, we need to do something to ensure these children have a chance in life and are not relegated to going back and suffering - not to mention, making them and their parents potential new enemies of our country. We need to stand for helping others and prove it. Of all the things our country spends money in other countries, helping children should be #1. We need more empathy and action, than sympathy and just shipping them back.

---

There are plenty of people that are natural born US citizens who are suffering. Is it "right" to expend limited resources on those who are not US citizens? Choices are tough, and many times there are no good options. America can't afford to take care of the world. Now, if America would allow the economic engine to work, maybe we could take care of "others." Unfortunately, and pardoxically, the same people who force America to no longer have the vibrant economy that it should scream about us not doing the "right" thing. Right, by definition, is what (in this case) is right for America and Americans. I don't know the answer, but to constantly scream for and demand "social justice" is not it. Proponents of "social justice" don't even know the meaning of the term. It does not, in fact, apply to government policy. It applies to choices of the individual.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by stodgdog

Proponents of "social justice" don't even know the meaning of the term. It does not, in fact, apply to government policy. It applies to choices of the individual.

---

Uh, wrong. The the root word of Social is society, which of course means more than one individual. Think "Social Security", for instance.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Woof!

Uh, wrong. The the root word of Social is society, which of course means more than one individual. Think "Social Security", for instance.

---

Social justice, properly defined, is a virtue. It can properly be ascribed only to the reflective and deliberate acts of individual persons. Most who use the term, however, ascribe it not to individuals but to social systems. They use "social justice" to denote a regulative principle of order. Their focus is not virtue but power.

"Go from the presence of the foolish man when thou perceivest not in him the lips of knowledge." Which means I'm not going to waste my time arguing with an idiot.

Sorry, the key word is "society" . :rolleyes:


http://i57.tinypic.com/sgige1.jpg

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by Woof!

Sorry, the key word is "society" . :rolleyes:


http://i57.tinypic.com/sgige1.jpg

---

Proven to not work world wide.

OK, whatever you want to believe. But, if social justice is virtuous (which it must be), then it can't be forced on others. If you want a just society, then the individuals who make that society must be just, by their own determination and free will. It is not regulated by government or forced on society. That is regulation or statute. Social justice can not be confused with legal justice, so don't try to go there. Societies develop, they are not created by government or law or regulation. Your definition, and the one you cited, of "social justice" makes no sense. It is merely a made up definition by the PC crowd to attempt to impart their thirst for power on what should be the free will of individuals. Evil intended people rely on people like you to be sheeple. Unfortunately, you and your ilk are destroying freedom to Americans. That is not just and definitely not your right.

Putting the onus on individuals kind of takes away from the social aspect of it, though.

You're both correct about social justice.

Quote:

---

Originally Posted by TYLERTECHSAS

Proven to not work world wide.

---

That is not entirely true. It works until people fight the system because it doesn't fit their particular wants.

How do some of you justify the difference in your opinion of stopping immigration for the sake of economics or safety VS. your religious views? This seems to be at odds, but I hear a lot of complaining with other issues are at odds with a law or policy.

Sure, we can't afford to take care of the whole world, but how do you justify sending children back to horrible, dangerous, and in-humane conditions? It isn't Christian - we all know that.