Quote:
Originally Posted by Blue Dawg
A+ Interesting use of sarcasm
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Blue Dawg
A+ Interesting use of sarcasm
All I want is the right to the weapons I'm paying for Ukrainian mobs, cartels, and the Taliban to own.Quote:
Originally Posted by ChipDog
Honestly...I look forward to your posts.Quote:
Originally Posted by Blue Dawg
Who are these Ukrainian mobs you are referring to?Quote:
Originally Posted by Blue Dawg
I'll acknowledge that the Mexican drug cartels, the Taliban, and probably many other unsavory groups are in possession of American weapons paid for by our tax dollars.
(A) Let’s assume Zelenskyy isn’t a common criminal, how long until one of those Stinger Missiles we’re sending to Ukraine turns up in the hands of bad guys inside the US?
(B) Let’s assume Zelenskyy is a common criminal, how long until one of those Stinger Missiles we’re sending to Ukraine turns up in the hands of bad guys inside the US?
The Russians (= terrorists) have attacked and destroyed the dam in Kerson, in southern Ukraine, causing a huge catastrophe of flooding (80 towns will be impacted), draining a reservoir which provides drinking water for a million people, and! draining the reservoir which provides critical water for cooling the nearby nuclear power plant, the largest nuclear power plant in Europe. Now, another Chernobyl-type disaster is very likely to happen, while cutting off power to millions of people.
This is nothing but an act of terrorism, a temper tantrum of a child (Putin) who is not getting his way. But, I know, there are a couple of folks here who support Putin...hope you're happy.
After warning the UN that Ukraine might blow the dam, retreating from Kherson because Ukraine might blow the dam, seeing Ukraine's generals openly speculate about how they might blow the dam, Russia obviously blew the dam, flooding their own territory, stranding more than a few of their own equipment, and again endangering the Crimean water supply. Makes perfect sense.
I guess Crimea survived without official water infrastructure after Minsk. Bigger issue is the nuclear power plant upriver that might have cooling issues now.
It's possible that it really was Russia. Russia has threatened infrastructure before (but besides ammo depots across Ukraine, hasn't really followed through). Given that Russia is unwilling to follow through on threats of this nature, and that it comes during the attempted Ukrainian counteroffensive, and hurts Russia's logistics more than Ukraine's, there's an obvious culprit to lean towards.
Thankfully the damage so far, while bad, doesn't appear to be as catastrophic as the worst case scenario.
The cartels seem to save the heavy ordnance for fights between themselves, at least in Mexico. I was going to say against the govt, but Mexico has no functional govt, just different cartels. So practically speaking, its the same chance/timeline of seeing open cartel warfare inside the US. Not a huge chance, but not negligible either.Quote:
Originally Posted by ChipDog
To Zelenskyy's credit, you aren't much of a "common" criminal if you've weaseled your way to a blank check from the largest economic power in history :laugh:
That damn dam...both sides are blaming the other:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-NnT2qM5WA0
Early in the invasion the Russians captured the nuclear power plant, but were driven out by a Ukran counter-attack, but then the Russians attacked again, and it was during this second attempt the Russians were shelling the plant endangering the plant and continuing the attack even as local civilians had taken refuge at the plant. It was at this time the Azov Battalion heroically defended the plant, pushing the Russians back and allowing the civilians to evacuate. A contingent of the Azov unit then decided to stay and while they held on the Russians were shelling the plant, and also shooting missiles at it, even damaging the concrete containment structure. The surviving Azov heroes decided to surrender, most of them wounded in some kind of way, to prevent a nuclear crisis.
Stalin ordered the destruction of a dam near Novgorod during Hitler's invasion of the Soviet Union, to deter the German advance in that region. Stalin did not want to alert the Germans so there was no warning issued to the Soviet people in the area to evacuate killing many tens of thousands of his own citizens. Putin is as evil as Stalin so his ordering the destruction of the dam fits him perfectly.
And, who benefits from the destruction of the dam? The Russians do. They are losing the war, they wanted to thwart the pending offensive by the Ukrans and creating a huge, flooded area, rather than just a well-defined river, which the Ukrans have been crossing already to the north, creates a barrier which is much harder to cross. Putin doesn't give a rat's ass about the nuclear power plant which is supplying huge portions of Europe, and he doesn't care about any drinking water issues that might affect Crimea either. He is losing Crimea, he knows it, and Russian civilians have been evacuating Crimea for weeks and his own forces, both the army and the navy, have begun pulling units out of Crimea in anticipation of a complete withdrawal.
Oh, it is completely laughable that the Russians haven't "followed through on their threats" to attack civilian infrastructure. They have been doing so routinely for over 18 months. Just last week they targeted and destroyed a civilian hospital. Months ago they fired a cruise missile into a hotel resort near the beach. It was NOT in any way a Ukran military facility. I even posted about it, the owner saying most of his guests historically had been Russians on holiday.
A Russian missile yesterday struck a street in Kyiv killing a carload of civilians. You have to have your head pretty far up Putin's butt to make an asinine statement that the Russians...the good guys in some people's eyes...have not been purposely targeting civilians. They blew the dam for the reasons given above.
This just in, the Russian bastards are lobbing artillery shells at the fleeing populace escaping the flood. No reports of casualties, yet.
Some have labeled the destruction of a dam in Ukraine at the hands of their enemy, Russia, as a terrorist act. I’ve never heard anyone call the Royal Air Force (Great Britain) “terrorists” for their skillful and strategic WW2 raid in which they took out 2 dams in Germany.
I guess it’s incorrect to say Zelenskyy is a “common” criminal. He certainly isn’t common to have persuaded the Biden Administration and a large portion of the US government to provide a seemingly unending supply of weapons at the US Taxpayers expense.
Perhaps when the last Ukraine soldier has been killed and there’s no one left to fire the weopons, the supply of weopons may stop. And what will have been accomplished? Yes, there’s really not much that’s common about Zelenskyy. Only Hitler and a few others have gone down in history as completely destroying their own country and decimating their country’s society to the degree Zelenskyy seems determined to reach.
I'm not hung up on labels such as "terrorist" when referring to combatants in a war. Clearly the destruction of the dam and the flooding of that area was a military strategic move by the Russians. This act, even with its collateral damage to civilians, has thwarted the pending offensive in southern Ukraine. What was an easily crossable river, with the Ukrans in possession of bridging capability (pontoon bridges), has been turned into a flooded area which, depending on the terrain, will be between 3 to 5 miles wide. Now the portable bridges are useless there and instead the Ukrans will have to come up with boats to move troops and equipment. Putin is losing, he knows it, and this was a desperate act to delay the inevitable defeat he will face. That said, so while there is a military aspect to this, it is also quite clear that Putin wanted to leave behind damage to punish the people who dared to stand up to him.Quote:
Originally Posted by ChipDog
Why is President Z a "criminal"? I asked Blue Dawg to define "Ukrainian mobs" which he has not done so yet.
And now you compare President Z to Hitler? I hope this is not some intellectually lazy (and stupidly ridiculous) way of trying to paint President Z as the "bad guy" in this circumstance. Ukraine, President Z, did not start this war. He did not invade Russia. Putin was so confident in his paper tiger army he made all kinds of boasts last February (2022). He was going to completely take over Ukraine and bring it back into his (and his desired Soviet Union) control. Putin even said he might invade Poland too. Putin also said, on several occasions, he would capture President Z and execute him, his wife and his children as a warning to others in other countries. And other Ukrainian officials too.
So, please explain in the face of this wanton, naked aggression by a foreign power how President Z is guilty of destroying his country. Here's your statement:
Only Hitler and a few others have gone down in history as completely destroying their own country and decimating their country’s society to the degree Zelenskyy seems determined to reach.
This should be good...
LOL! Putin wiped out his own troops! Ya gotta love it!
The west side of the Dnipro River is higher elevation, that's where the Ukrans are. The east side is part of the natural flood plain for the river and that is where Putin's thugs were. Early reports from drone video say hundreds of Russian soldiers have drowned in the flood, the rest barely able to escape but they left behind all their vehicles, equipment, heavy weapons, now all under water. Hah hah!
You can't make this stuff up!
Two Russian attack helicopters fired on and destroyed two John Deere farm harvesters in Russian-held territory of eastern Ukraine. The farms are close to the combat zone along the front, just a few miles away. The helicopters were on routine patrol when ground forces communicated to them to be on watch for Ukran tanks that were reported to be in the area. From a distance of about 3/4 mile the helicopters spotted the John Deere machines, peacefully working on a farm, and fired missiles. Both machines were destroyed, the drivers, the farmers, are reported to be alive but badly injured, taken to a nearby Russian army hospital for treatment.
Later the Russians offered what amounts to a very weak apology, denying any blame, showing what the pilots saw on video captured from the 'copters. The Russians have very crappy technology. The targeting system, a heads up display, is VERY poor quality, black & white image, very blurry. The pilots say it was an understandable mis-identification claiming the John Deere machines looked like tanks to them. The released video is very poor, yep! And in one stopped image the arm which shoots the grain into a truck looks like a gun of a tank...kind of. :icon_roll:
Okay, let's try this. Given how crappy their targeting system is, even if they were tanks, how would they know if they were Ukran or friendly Russian tanks? The answer is, they wouldn't know. There have been plenty of friendly-fire incidents by the goofy Russians, and if I were a Russian tanker, I wouldn't want those Russian attack helicopters operating anywhere close to me.