My thoughts on bowl situation

I have allowed myself time to think and for more facts to be released about this whole ordeal. I am not the most knowledgeable individual on bowl invites and athletic politics, but I do know the following:
1) Liberty Bowl: If the Liberty Bowl was going to "Invite Tech all along" then Bruce should have said "FORMALLY INVITE US NOW!" We should have demanded the promised invite at 11:00am Sunday. Bruce got played by the Liberty Bowl but also by his own stupidity. If somebody told me they were going to invite me to their party I would ask them "watcha waiting for?" They were never going to invite us unless it was their last option and simply wanted to string us along.
2) NIU in BCS: I looked at the Media poll Sunday after church and saw NIU ranked 15 and based on teams losing in front of them felt about 90% positive that NIU would get to the Orange Bowl. Bruce's comment "We were shocked when NIU jumped that high" is an outright lie or proof of his own stupidity. Heck, they jumped all the way to #15 in the BCS.
3) Decision Making: If you have 3 bowl possibilities on the table, 2 (HOD & LB) of which are not 100% and 1 (INDY) of which is 100% and the 1 bowl that is 100% gives you a deadline, then you take the 100% and tell your fans, coach, and players that this was our best offer because it was our ONLY offer.
4) "We didn't turn down any bowl invitation": If a bowl gives you a deadline and you don't call them back by that deadline, you said NO and TURNED DOWN their invitation. Just like the Liberty Bowl never said NO to Tech, but they never invited Tech so yeah, they said NO to Tech.
5) Ego: Who are we that we think we are better than the Independence Bowl? Just because we played in the Poinsetta Bowl last year are we now better than the Indy Bowl? Just because we have the #1 offense in the nation are we to good for the Indy Bowl? By trying to take us on a "natural progression" of bowls, you sent us down a "path of regression" that we never know the full effects of. Boise State played in 2 Humanitarian Bowls in 3 years. BYU played in 5 straight Las Vegas Bowls. Southern Miss has played in the New Orleans Bowl 4 times. Our EGO is why a 9-3 football team and 31 seniors are sitting at home.
6) Bruce's Statement: As he said in an interview - We finished 3rd place in a conference that will not exist next year, that has no bargaining power this year and only has 1 automatic bowl bid. If you are a lame duck you take the GUARANTEE offer no matter where it is played and no matter who it is played against.

firebvdv.com? :)

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Originally Posted by Beaz17

I have allowed myself time to think and for more facts to be released about this whole ordeal. I am not the most knowledgeable individual on bowl invites and athletic politics, but I do know the following:
1) Liberty Bowl: If the Liberty Bowl was going to "Invite Tech all along" then Bruce should have said "FORMALLY INVITE US NOW!" We should have demanded the promised invite at 11:00am Sunday. Bruce got played by the Liberty Bowl but also by his own stupidity. If somebody told me they were going to invite me to their party I would ask them "watcha waiting for?" They were never going to invite us unless it was their last option and simply wanted to string us along.
2) NIU in BCS: I looked at the Media poll Sunday after church and saw NIU ranked 15 and based on teams losing in front of them felt about 90% positive that NIU would get to the Orange Bowl. Bruce's comment "We were shocked when NIU jumped that high" is an outright lie or proof of his own stupidity. Heck, they jumped all the way to #15 in the BCS.
3) Decision Making: If you have 3 bowl possibilities on the table, 2 (HOD & LB) of which are not 100% and 1 (INDY) of which is 100% and the 1 bowl that is 100% gives you a deadline, then you take the 100% and tell your fans, coach, and players that this was our best offer because it was our ONLY offer.
4) "We didn't turn down any bowl invitation": If a bowl gives you a deadline and you don't call them back by that deadline, you said NO and TURNED DOWN their invitation. Just like the Liberty Bowl never said NO to Tech, but they never invited Tech so yeah, they said NO to Tech.
5) Ego: Who are we that we think we are better than the Independence Bowl? Just because we played in the Poinsetta Bowl last year are we now better than the Indy Bowl? Just because we have the #1 offense in the nation are we to good for the Indy Bowl? By trying to take us on a "natural progression" of bowls, you sent us down a "path of regression" that we never know the full effects of. Boise State played in 2 Humanitarian Bowls in 3 years. BYU played in 5 straight Las Vegas Bowls. Southern Miss has played in the New Orleans Bowl 4 times. Our EGO is why a 9-3 football team and 31 seniors are sitting at home.
6) Bruce's Statement: As he said in an interview - We finished 3rd place in a conference that will not exist next year, that has no bargaining power this year and only has 1 automatic bowl bid. If you are a lame duck you take the GUARANTEE offer no matter where it is played and no matter who it is played against.

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Indy withdrew their offer early Saturday afternoon, so your 1 and 2 wouldn't have changed the outcome.

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Originally Posted by Beaz17

I have allowed myself time to think and for more facts to be released about this whole ordeal. I am not the most knowledgeable individual on bowl invites and athletic politics, but I do know the following:
1) Liberty Bowl: If the Liberty Bowl was going to "Invite Tech all along" then Bruce should have said "FORMALLY INVITE US NOW!" We should have demanded the promised invite at 11:00am Sunday. Bruce got played by the Liberty Bowl but also by his own stupidity. If somebody told me they were going to invite me to their party I would ask them "watcha waiting for?" They were never going to invite us unless it was their last option and simply wanted to string us along.
2) NIU in BCS: I looked at the Media poll Sunday after church and saw NIU ranked 15 and based on teams losing in front of them felt about 90% positive that NIU would get to the Orange Bowl. Bruce's comment "We were shocked when NIU jumped that high" is an outright lie or proof of his own stupidity. Heck, they jumped all the way to #15 in the BCS.
3) Decision Making: If you have 3 bowl possibilities on the table, 2 (HOD & LB) of which are not 100% and 1 (INDY) of which is 100% and the 1 bowl that is 100% gives you a deadline, then you take the 100% and tell your fans, coach, and players that this was our best offer because it was our ONLY offer.
4) "We didn't turn down any bowl invitation": If a bowl gives you a deadline and you don't call them back by that deadline, you said NO and TURNED DOWN their invitation. Just like the Liberty Bowl never said NO to Tech, but they never invited Tech so yeah, they said NO to Tech.
5) Ego: Who are we that we think we are better than the Independence Bowl? Just because we played in the Poinsetta Bowl last year are we now better than the Indy Bowl? Just because we have the #1 offense in the nation are we to good for the Indy Bowl? By trying to take us on a "natural progression" of bowls, you sent us down a "path of regression" that we never know the full effects of. Boise State played in 2 Humanitarian Bowls in 3 years. BYU played in 5 straight Las Vegas Bowls. Southern Miss has played in the New Orleans Bowl 4 times. Our EGO is why a 9-3 football team and 31 seniors are sitting at home.
6) Bruce's Statement: As he said in an interview - We finished 3rd place in a conference that will not exist next year, that has no bargaining power this year and only has 1 automatic bowl bid. If you are a lame duck you take the GUARANTEE offer no matter where it is played and no matter who it is played against.

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Ding, Ding, Ding!! Winner!! TCU was in a a BCS bowl game, then played Tech in the Poinsettia Bowl. They didn't like it, but the TOOK it.

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Originally Posted by Brian96

Indy withdrew their offer early Saturday afternoon, so your 1 and 2 wouldn't have changed the outcome.

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#2: NIU played Friday night. Anybody could have run the figures with the below likely results and realized NIU would jump in the Orange Bowl. Everybody is saying NIU jumped into the BCS because Wisconsin beat Nebraska. Even if Nebraska beats Wisconsin NIU is #16 in the BCS and ranked ahead of Big East champion so they jumped to into the top 16 should NOT have been a shock. It could have been calculated that would likely make that jump Friday night. Even Tim Brando said he was scared for us because everything good for us hinged on NIU not making the BCS.

#20 Boise State - knew they would not move based on computer strength
#19 Michigan - sitting idle
#18 Texas - predicted to lose to Kansas State
#17 Kent State - LOST to NIU
#16 UCLA - predicted to lose to Stanford

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Originally Posted by Brian96

Indy withdrew their offer early Saturday afternoon, so your 1 and 2 wouldn't have changed the outcome.

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#1: Then Bruce should have asked for an offer from the Liberty Bowl early Saturday afternoon. If they said no, he would have known that they were not inviting us along. With that knowledge, he could have persued other opportunities.

Beaz, it sounds like Bruce had an inaccurate view of how bad the Liberty and Heart of Dallas Bowls wanted Tech, and it was a terrible blunder, and it was nobody's fault but his own.

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Originally Posted by TootNanny

Beaz, it sounds like Bruce had an inaccurate view of how bad the Liberty and Heart of Dallas Bowls wanted Tech, and it was a terrible blunder, and it was nobody's fault but his own.

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You're holding Bruce accountable for the fact that he didn't know a Bowl was going to lie to him? How long have you been reading peoples' minds?

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Originally Posted by ChuckK3

You're holding Bruce accountable for the fact that he didn't know a Bowl was going to lie to him? How long have you been reading peoples' minds?

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When a desired bowl tells you, "We're going to invite you," get out your pen and say, "Where do I sign?" If they don't want to shake on the deal just yet, then the smartest thing to do is take that as a "no."

Kind of like the Independence Bowl did to Tech.

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Originally Posted by Beaz17

I have allowed myself time to think and for more facts to be released about this whole ordeal. I am not the most knowledgeable individual on bowl invites and athletic politics, but I do know the following:
5) Ego: Who are we that we think we are better than the Independence Bowl? Just because we played in the Poinsetta Bowl last year are we now better than the Indy Bowl? Just because we have the #1 offense in the nation are we to good for the Indy Bowl? By trying to take us on a "natural progression" of bowls, you sent us down a "path of regression" that we never know the full effects of. Boise State played in 2 Humanitarian Bowls in 3 years. BYU played in 5 straight Las Vegas Bowls. Southern Miss has played in the New Orleans Bowl 4 times. Our EGO is why a 9-3 football team and 31 seniors are sitting at home.

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#5 and a lot of the other pride/ego/arrogance threads/better-than posts are CRAP!!!

We wanted the best deal for our team and our school. If you buy and auto or a house don't you aim for the best deal? Does that mean you're arrogant? How about getting the best investments for your money or have you ever applied for a better job? On vacation do you choose a Holiday Inn or just take your family to the cheapest you can get?

Good Lord, we just wanted the best deal for our players and fans and school. Liberty would have provided a slightly better deal. That's not any slam on the I Bowl, which was an acceptable alternative, it's just a fact. Simply look at which bowl has the better conference tie in. I Bowl people know that too. If there's an "ego" problem it's with the I Bowl wanting to bully and panic and punish Tech in disdain for the support we've given them.

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Originally Posted by TootNanny

When a desired bowl tells you, "We're going to invite you," get out your pen and say, "Where do I sign?" If they don't want to shake on the deal just yet, then the smartest thing to do is take that as a "no."

Kind of like the Independence Bowl did to Tech.

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I suppose in your oversimplified view of the world, yes. The reality, of which neither of us REALLY knows, is what we would do given the exact same set of circumstances and the exact same sequence of events.

On a related note...What school do you support, Toot?

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Originally Posted by Russdawg

#5 and a lot of the other pride/ego/arrogance threads/better-than posts are CRAP!!!

We wanted the best deal for our team and our school. If you buy and auto or a house don't you aim for the best deal? Does that mean you're arrogant? How about getting the best investments for your money or have you ever applied for a better job? On vacation do you choose a Holiday Inn or just take your family to the cheapest you can get?

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If I had to choose between the cheapest hotel I could get and NO hotel at all I would choose the cheapest location that put a roof over my families head.

If I had to choose between the cheapest auto I could get and NO auto at all I would choose the cheapest auto that got me where I need to go.

If I had to choose between a 1% investment on my money and 0% investment I would choose 1% because it is a profit.

If I had to choose between something and NOTHING I will always choose something.

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Originally Posted by Beaz17

If I had to choose between the cheapest hotel I could get and NO hotel at all I would choose the cheapest location that put a roof over my families head.

If I had to choose between the cheapest auto I could get and NO auto at all I would choose the cheapest auto that got me where I need to go.

If I had to choose between a 1% investment on my money and 0% investment I would choose 1% because it is a profit.

If I had to choose between something and NOTHING I will always choose something.

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These are all false analogies, because we were not choosing between a sure thing and nothing. We were choosing between two apparently sure things, one which was not as good and had a sooner deadline.

Please google "hindsight bias," read up on the topic, and then return to the discussion.

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Originally Posted by Brian96

These are all false analogies, because we were not choosing between a sure thing and nothing. We were choosing between two apparently sure things, one which was not as good and had a sooner deadline.

Please google "hindsight bias," read up on the topic, and then return to the discussion.

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Good response, Brian. Thanks. Beaz17 ignored the whole point that his #5 was BS, and it is!

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Originally Posted by Russdawg

#5 and a lot of the other pride/ego/arrogance threads/better-than posts are CRAP!!!

We wanted the best deal for our team and our school. If you buy and auto or a house don't you aim for the best deal? Does that mean you're arrogant? How about getting the best investments for your money or have you ever applied for a better job? On vacation do you choose a Holiday Inn or just take your family to the cheapest you can get?

Good Lord, we just wanted the best deal for our players and fans and school. Liberty would have provided a slightly better deal. That's not any slam on the I Bowl, which was an acceptable alternative, it's just a fact. Simply look at which bowl has the better conference tie in. I Bowl people know that too. If there's an "ego" problem it's with the I Bowl wanting to bully and panic and punish Tech in disdain for the support we've given them.

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I can't quite follow your logic. We weren't "buying" anything as long term as insurance or a house.

Playing off your analogy...we were just trying to find our next good meal (bowl $) and a place to sit around and fellowship (fans doing their thing). We just needed a good restaurant that agreed to feed us and let us hang out. If we were driving around in a car trying to make the above decision, 9 times out of 10 we take the convenient restaurant (available now and calling us to see if we're coming) and not the one that can't confirm when we will be able to have a table just that it'll be soon.

I know this is corny. But I can't fathom that we are sitting at home while other teams are bowling...we should have taken the opportunity to earn a little money and beat the snot out of the JC down the road.

Thanks Beaz! Don't let em discourage you! Really though #3 is all that matters! Bird in the hand......

Both sides made mistakes. The I Bowl will lose a lot of money off of this. Ohio???? Really? How many people are they gonna bring?

As for Bruce. ....... You get it in writing, email, telegram, telegraph, ANYTHING BUT VERBAL.

And NO ONE will be able to convince me Ohio wouldn't have waited until Sunday like 90% of all the other schools did.

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Originally Posted by Bigdog13

Both sides made mistakes. The I Bowl will lose a lot of money off of this. Ohio???? Really? How many people are they gonna bring?

As for Bruce. ....... You get it in writing, email, telegram, telegraph, ANYTHING BUT VERBAL.

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One thing I'm not clear on is how much of this is done in writing. How did our invitation to the I-Bowl on Thursday get relayed?

I get the logic of wanting something in wriritng, but my impression is that the wheeling-and-dealing for at-large bowl spots is a very verbal process. But, as has been pointed out, even with a verbal process, there are certainly things that could have been done to tighten things up. But that, too, is something much clearer with hindsight.

I still maintain that BVDV did the right things in this situation. Sure, he could have done things better--there is almost always room for improvement--but that is not the same as doing it wrong. And the improvements he would need to make would have to predicate on an assumption that he was being lied to by one or more parties.

Another thing I'm confused by is ESPN's role. It is often stated on here that nothing happens with bowl selections without ESPN's blessing. Is it plausible that they would have blessed allowing the #1 offense in the country and the Sammy Baugh award winner being locked out? Seems like they lost an easy ratings boost (though likely not a dramatic one) in not having us to sell. It makes me question how much direct influence they have on bowl sections.