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Thread: When can the Saints blow it up?

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    When can the Saints blow it up?

    Ready for them to have the opportunity to put money where they need to in order to compete again.

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    Re: When can the Saints blow it up?

    I'm having my doubts that the duo of Payton/Loomis can get it done. Except for a few "diamonds in the rough," like Graham, Colston, P. Thomas, Lance Moore, they haven't done much of nothing to bring in top talent. When we won the Super Bowl after the 2009 season, that was Payton's 4th year, but he still had the core of Jim Haslett's players. Brees completed his 4th year of a 5-year deal, and when it came time to renegotiate in 2011, Brees held the Saints for ransom and management had no choice but to find room under the cap by not re-signing some key players. That started the decline.

    Had the Bountygate year, 2012, that interrupted Payton's tenure. Bounced back in '13 going 11-5 and winning a road playoff game for the first time ever (over Philly). But, it's been 7-9, 7-9, and now 5-8. I don't see Payton/Loomis/Brees being able to get it done. It's time to clean house and start from ground zero.

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    Re: When can the Saints blow it up?

    Quote Originally Posted by dawg80 View Post
    I'm having my doubts that the duo of Payton/Loomis can get it done. Except for a few "diamonds in the rough," like Graham, Colston, P. Thomas, Lance Moore, they haven't done much of nothing to bring in top talent. When we won the Super Bowl after the 2009 season, that was Payton's 4th year, but he still had the core of Jim Haslett's players. Brees completed his 4th year of a 5-year deal, and when it came time to renegotiate in 2011, Brees held the Saints for ransom and management had no choice but to find room under the cap by not re-signing some key players. That started the decline.

    Had the Bountygate year, 2012, that interrupted Payton's tenure. Bounced back in '13 going 11-5 and winning a road playoff game for the first time ever (over Philly). But, it's been 7-9, 7-9, and now 5-8. I don't see Payton/Loomis/Brees being able to get it done. It's time to clean house and start from ground zero.
    I think everyone knows that's not going to happen as long as Tom Benson is alive.

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    Re: When can the Saints blow it up?

    I don't agree that Payton won with Haslett's players, but something definitely needs to change. In a typical year, there is about 30% roster turnover for an NFL team. In Payton's first year, he had 55% turnover because he cut tons of people and picked up free agents to replace them (Fujita, Shanle, etc.). Of course signing Brees was big, and he was a huge upgrade over Aaron Brooks - the most undeserving member of the Saints Hall of Fame.

    That said, somebody needs to shake things up. Payton is known for loyalty to his assistant coaches, but he's being loyal to a fault. Greg McMahon has GOT to go as special teams coach. Loomis needs to be fired from the Pelicans so he can focus on the job he was originally hired to do. Ever since Benson put him in charge of basketball in addition to football, our drafts have been terrible. They brought in Greg Ireland last year as an Asst. GM, and that has improved our scouting and drafting a little (if the players could stay healthy, that would be a big help). We will finally escape from salary cap hell at the end of this season, so hopefully we will be players in free agency. I just hope we make wise decisions, instead of over-paying for guys like Jairus Byrd.

    This offseason is a pretty important one.

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    Re: When can the Saints blow it up?

    Quote Originally Posted by StrayDawg View Post
    I don't agree that Payton won with Haslett's players, but something definitely needs to change. In a typical year, there is about 30% roster turnover for an NFL team. In Payton's first year, he had 55% turnover because he cut tons of people and picked up free agents to replace them (Fujita, Shanle, etc.). Of course signing Brees was big, and he was a huge upgrade over Aaron Brooks - the most undeserving member of the Saints Hall of Fame.

    That said, somebody needs to shake things up. Payton is known for loyalty to his assistant coaches, but he's being loyal to a fault. Greg McMahon has GOT to go as special teams coach. Loomis needs to be fired from the Pelicans so he can focus on the job he was originally hired to do. Ever since Benson put him in charge of basketball in addition to football, our drafts have been terrible. They brought in Greg Ireland last year as an Asst. GM, and that has improved our scouting and drafting a little (if the players could stay healthy, that would be a big help). We will finally escape from salary cap hell at the end of this season, so hopefully we will be players in free agency. I just hope we make wise decisions, instead of over-paying for guys like Jairus Byrd.

    This offseason is a pretty important one.
    I agree about McMahon. In recent weeks they've brought in several consultants to help the special teams situation. Yet, Payton is loyal to a fault with his friends. McMahon is one them.

    No doubt the drafts and free agent decisions have been sub par over the past four years. Some worse than others. The biggest problem for me is that it's a pattern that doesn't seem to change. Will Lutz is a perfect example. Everyone knew a rookie kicker who was mediocre in college at Georgia State was going to struggle this season. Yet they signed him and let Kai Forbath go. Forbath doesn't have the biggest leg, but he was almost automatic inside 50 yards. That's the type of kicker I would want with Drew Brees in the final few seasons of his career.

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    Re: When can the Saints blow it up?

    Quote Originally Posted by The Historian View Post
    . Will Lutz is a perfect example. Everyone knew a rookie kicker who was mediocre in college at Georgia State was going to struggle this season. Yet they signed him and let Kai Forbath go..
    If he doesn't go wacko, Will Lutz will be special, in a good way.
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    Re: When can the Saints blow it up?

    I think the opportunity to win another Super Bowl with Brees is over.

    If you had decent management you would start thinking two to three years down the road and start developing, drafting, trading for younger talent.

    Most people hate them, but the Pats know when to cut bait on players.

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    Re: When can the Saints blow it up?

    Quote Originally Posted by revf View Post
    I think the opportunity to win another Super Bowl with Brees is over.

    If you had decent management you would start thinking two to three years down the road and start developing, drafting, trading for younger talent.

    Most people hate them, but the Pats know when to cut bait on players.

    Absolutely! I don't know the inner workings of their contract negotiations by any means. However, it looks like they get guys who are in their prime and play them for 2-3 seasons and pay them what they are worth then they are gone. Most teams sign players to 5 year contracts that no other team wants to absorb when they are on the downside of great with a good year left.

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    Re: When can the Saints blow it up?

    Third straight 7-9 season. Diehard Saints' fans on Facebook and some blogs continue to write it off as an anomaly. I think THREE in a row constitutes a definite trend. Especially in the NFL where teams routinely go from 6-10 to 11-5, and vice-versa year to year.

    There have been 9 5,000-yard passing seasons in the entire history of the NFL. Brees now holds 5 of those. Wow! and BFD! Already news from the Saints camp is we won't be able to keep some of our better players due to the salary cap (free agency). How come this doesn't happen to other teams, not at this level year after year? YES, I KNOW every NFL team loses key players to free agency. But others also seem to sign good replacements and re-tool.

    The 2016 Saints became only the second team in NFL history, joining the Broncos, to have a: 5,000 yd passer, 1,000 yd rusher, and two 1,000 yd receivers. Saints were again, the #1 offense in the NFL. That deserves another BFD.

    Yesterday, the #2 offense in the NFL, the Dirty Birds, made the Saints' D look completely helpless. That is until, they took their foot off the gas pedal, lost their rhythm and "watch out!" Even the lowly Saints, with that potent offense, can make a run at ya if you blink.

    I have no problem with the Saints being #1 in offense. But without a decent defense, it doesn't matter. Who cares if Brees, and the Saints' offense, sets records that may never be broken....at least not in our lifetimes, if we go 7-9 again.

    Sean Payton is rumored to be gone. Most likely to the Chargers who are headed to Los Angeles. That's the Internet rhetoric, anyway, FWIW.

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    Re: When can the Saints blow it up?

    Brees 5000 yards is meaningless when the real stat that matters is 7-9.

    I mean he is not even the best QB in the NFC South. That belongs to Ryan. A case could be made in a year or two he is the worst QB in the NFC South. I think Winston will get better.

    As I said before with the departure of Peyton, why not blow it up. Trade off and go younger. Take a few years of 2-12 football, draft well, trade well and set yourself up like the Seahawks to be competitive for several years in a row.

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    Re: When can the Saints blow it up?

    Should have traded Brees 2-3 yrs ago and gotten big value. Still might could.
    PSA: Please realise the impotence of proof reading before you post.

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    Re: When can the Saints blow it up?

    let them go to LA and get us some fresh blood!

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    Re: When can the Saints blow it up?

    They are my Saints
    ''Don't be a bad dagh..."

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    Re: When can the Saints blow it up?

    Quote Originally Posted by Dwayne From Minden View Post
    They are my Saints
    They are definitely "the Saints."

    I can see why you are also a Cubs' fan.

    Actually, I'm stuck with the Saints too. Have invested too much grief over 50 years to abandon them now.

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    Re: When can the Saints blow it up?

    Quote Originally Posted by dawg80 View Post
    They are definitely "the Saints."

    I can see why you are also a Cubs' fan.

    Actually, I'm stuck with the Saints too. Have invested too much grief over 50 years to abandon them now.
    I find it highly amusing all of these Johnny-Come-Lately Saints Fans who have NO IDEA what the "long suffering Saints" are all about

    As I told some of my family over the Christmas holidays - that the Cubs would win another World Series before the Saints even sniffed at a Super Bowl - they scoffed at me...

    I told them it all starts with management - and the Saints have NONE...
    ''Don't be a bad dagh..."

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