The Violent Left

[johnnylightnin]

If that close family member refused to comply with police orders, if that close family member had a history of violence and told the police that he had a gun in his car, no problem with it. Did you expect your children to listen to you when they were young? Did you teach them to obey those in positions of authority or did you tell them to just say F off.. and do what ever they wanted to do? Johnny as you are a Christian man, I know you taught your children better.

The penalty for not listening to an officer isn't death.

[FriscoDog]

The penalty for not listening to an officer isn't death.

One he didn't die.. he is in stable condition.. Two.. so I can just obey the laws or people in authority that I want to and disregard the rest? A civilized society doesn't work like that.. Also when a violent criminal says he has a gun in his car and goes to get something out of his car.. as a police officer, would you wait until he produced it and shot you before drawing your weapon or shooting at him?

[johnnylightnin]

One he didn't die.. he is in stable condition.. Two.. so I can just obey the laws or people in authority that I want to and disregard the rest? A civilized society doesn't work like that.. Also when a violent criminal says he has a gun in his car and goes to get something out of his car.. as a police officer, would you wait until he produced it and shot you before drawing your weapon or shooting at him?

No, you obey or you face the consequences. Being shot in the back 7 times is just as unjust as whatever this guy is accused of.

[MoonPieBlue]

I can't answer your question because I'm not omniscient. What could they have done? If the perp was not putting them in mortal danger, they could've not shot him. Law and order doesn't mean that the police are justified in executing people who don't comply. Get back up. Let the guy walk off. That's the job.

If you can't understand why people are angry, you're not trying to understand.

So would you still be as upset if he were shot once in chest. You should at least be able to answer that.

The police aren't 'omniscient' either to use your word. I guess you'd be OK if he had reached in, pulled out a gun, shot a couple of officers and then they shot him (as long as it wasn't 7 times in the back).

Haven't cops been basically hamstrung in the responses they can use? Can't hit someone with a baton, can't put them in a choke hold, can't kneel on there back. So ultimately you can't restrain the individual, he breaks away and starts to get in a vehicle and you have no idea what's in the vehicle.

So I guess your solution is just to politely ask someone to comply and if they don't want to just wave at them as they drive off?

[MoonPieBlue]

No, you obey or you face the consequences. Being shot in the back 7 times is just as unjust as whatever this guy is accused of.

I don't think it has anything to do with what he is accused of either. It's his action with the police that lead to the shooting.

[johnnylightnin]

So would you still be as upset if he were shot once in chest. You should at least be able to answer that.

The police aren't 'omniscient' either to use your word. I guess you'd be OK if he had reached in, pulled out a gun, shot a couple of officers and then they shot him (as long as it wasn't 7 times in the back).

Haven't cops been basically hamstrung in the responses they can use? Can't hit someone with a baton, can't put them in a choke hold, can't kneel on there back. So ultimately you can't restrain the individual, he breaks away and starts to get in a vehicle and you have no idea what's in the vehicle.

So I guess your solution is just to politely ask someone to comply and if they don't want to just wave at them as they drive off?

Nobody says it's an easy job. I have had close officer friends who have had "altercations" that have led to paid administrative leave. I've seen how difficult it is for these guys to negotiate tough situations. THAT'S THE JOB.

You can't shoot someone because of a potential threat. Once the threat presents itself, you have to do what you have to do.

The fact is that a man with no gun who was not within arms length of the officers was shot in the back 7 times. I can't imagine trying to defend that.

[MoonPieBlue]

Nobody says it's an easy job. I have had close officer friends who have had "altercations" that have led to paid administrative leave. I've seen how difficult it is for these guys to negotiate tough situations. THAT'S THE JOB.

You can't shoot someone because of a potential threat. Once the threat presents itself, you have to do what you have to do.

The fact is that a man with no gun who was not within arms length of the officers was shot in the back 7 times. I can't imagine trying to defend that.

So the person says "I've got a gun in my car" (I don't know if he said that have just heard others indicate it), proceeds to try and get in the car, you don't perceive that as a threat? Do you have to see the gun or weapon first? Do you let him get off the first shot? If he's got a knife and you've got a gun is it OK to shoot?

[johnnylightnin]

So the person says "I've got a gun in my car" (I don't know if he said that have just heard others indicate it), proceeds to try and get in the car, you don't perceive that as a threat? Do you have to see the gun or weapon first? Do you let him get off the first shot? If he's got a knife and you've got a gun is it OK to shoot?

It's a potential threat, sure. How is he going to get the first shot off if I have my gun pointed at him? These are professionals. You have multiple guns trained on one guy...give me a break.

[MoonPieBlue]

It's a potential threat, sure. How is he going to get the first shot off if I have my gun pointed at him? These are professionals. You have multiple guns trained on one guy...give me a break.

I'm sorry I'm not "omniscient' either . Why in the world do you make such a move with multiple guns pointed on you? I think a lot of this has to do with what's been building over the years. Due to rioting etc. people don't think they should follow any police officer's order (request), the police are probably so concerned with being filmed doing something wrong, using a choke hold, kneeling, apply any force to subdue the person that they don't apply that necessary force. I think some years ago the officers would have applied a "heavier" hand. It would look bad but could have prevented what happened. Again I'm by no means happy the guy got shot and do agree 7 times is excessive. Peaceful protests would be understandable.

I do appreciate your rational discussion.

[PawDawg]

The people who are angry are reacting peacefully.

The people who are reacting with with riots and destruction are animals and enjoy destruction or enjoy what Soros is paying them to destroy.

[DawgyNWindow]

It's a potential threat, sure. How is he going to get the first shot off if I have my gun pointed at him? These are professionals. You have multiple guns trained on one guy...give me a break.

How will he get the first shot off?

Well, if you allow him to continue resisting and get away from you and go to his car and pull a firearm from the front seat and then turn around with an active trigger finger, he gets the first shot off. When do you react if you are the policeman? When he gets that shot off?

I dunno, I think I would have shot him just like the officer if I felt my life was in danger. I like to return home to my wife and family at the end of the day.

Did this guy have a history of assaulting police? I read that, but just like all these incidents you cannot trust any reporting for at least a couple of weeks. It's all just a bunch of knee-jerk narrative regurgitation, race baiting and wild pontificating (just like I did) until the full facts surface.

I wouldn't be a law enforcement officer for three times the money they pay them. I did try to impress upon my kids the importance of cooperating with the police if they were approached/pulled over....probably saved my son's life.

[johnnylightnin]

How will he get the first shot off?

Well, if you allow him to continue resisting and get away from you and go to his car and pull a firearm from the front seat and then turn around with an active trigger finger, he gets the first shot off. When do you react if you are the policeman? When he gets that shot off?

I dunno, I think I would have shot him just like the officer if I felt my life was in danger. I like to return home to my wife and family at the end of the day.

Did this guy have a history of assaulting police? I read that, but just like all these incidents you cannot trust any reporting for at least a couple of weeks. It's all just a bunch of knee-jerk narrative regurgitation, race baiting and wild pontificating (just like I did) until the full facts surface.

I wouldn't be a law enforcement officer for three times the money they pay them. I did try to impress upon my kids the importance of cooperating with the police if they were approached/pulled over....probably saved my son's life.

A distressed perp getting the jump on you and getting the jump on 3 or 4 cops who ALREADY have their guns drawn is two different things.

[DawgyNWindow]

A distressed perp getting the jump on you and getting the jump on 3 or 4 cops who ALREADY have their guns drawn is two different things.

But none could see what he was grabbing or doing inside the car. He wasn't going to win a confrontation, but he could easily have shot one or two of the officers before they neutralized the threat. Suicide by cop happens all the time.

Horribly difficult job, and easy for everyone to second guess from the living room sofa. I have no idea how they get anyone to do it, because you could either end up dead or in jail for the rest of your life merely by doing your job in attempting to arrest someone. Perhaps they should sent the attorneys and judges out to round up these folks with outstanding warrants. 48 officers were feloniously killed wile on duty in 2019, including three who were "attempting to restrain/control. handcuff the offender(s) during the arrest situations."

If this guy had been running away and they shot him I would be cheering on the prosecution, but he was evading the police while they attempted to arrest him on outstanding warrants and was intent on digging something out of the cab of his vehicle during the confrontation. The police had nanoseconds to determine if his actions represented a threat. Thank heaven I don't have to face that kind of threat every day of my life!

[turbodawg]

His kids were in the car.

[MoonPieBlue]

His kids were in the car.

Agreed. Another reason to peacefully submit to being handcuffed and taken to the precinct. Why put anyone (particularly your own kids) in danger by resisting arrest?