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Thread: Russia

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    Re: Russia

    Quote Originally Posted by Guisslapp View Post

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    Re: Russia

    Quote Originally Posted by Guisslapp View Post
    I am beginning to think you have this enshrined in your home and pay regular homage to it. May I ask one question without you consulting your ouij... I mean pictograph or your referring to Fox News? Is there any level of acceptable criticism of the media or does it all equal blasphemy to you?

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    Re: Russia

    Quote Originally Posted by atobulldog View Post
    I am beginning to think you have this enshrined in your home and pay regular homage to it. May I ask one question without you consulting your ouij... I mean pictograph or your referring to Fox News? Is there any level of acceptable criticism of the media or does it all equal blasphemy to you?
    Legitimate criticism is always acceptable to me, but the specific brainwashing strategy referenced in that cycle is a propaganda scheme employed by FoxNews, the president and a few others, and their constant drumbeat of the narrative is meant to stoke fear and paranoia and distort reality. The specific devices that are mentioned in that cycle are not legitimate criticisms - most out outright logical fallacies and the others are designed to play on people’s impulses rather than their reasoning skills. It is, unfortunately, effective. Thus, I will make an effort to highlight to you guys when it is being used.

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    Re: Russia

    Quote Originally Posted by Guisslapp View Post
    Legitimate criticism is always acceptable to me, but the specific brainwashing strategy referenced in that cycle is a propaganda scheme employed by FoxNews, the president and a few others, and their constant drumbeat of the narrative is meant to stoke fear and paranoia and distort reality. The specific devices that are mentioned in that cycle are not legitimate criticisms - most out outright logical fallacies and the others are designed to play on people’s impulses rather than their reasoning skills. It is, unfortunately, effective. Thus, I will make an effort to highlight to you guys when it is being used.
    And you couldn't even do it. I guess my problem with the "cycle" that you have enshrined is that you use it to singularly critique Fox News. Do you at least admit that at times, other outlets are guilty of the same exact fallacies? You want to play this as completely one sided and other outlets are squeaky clean, I can assure you that they are not. I don't put a lot of credibility in Fox News, about the same I put into MSNBC and Vox because they are usually guilty of the same fallacies just from different slants.

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    Re: Russia

    Quote Originally Posted by atobulldog View Post
    And you couldn't even do it. I guess my problem with the "cycle" that you have enshrined is that you use it to singularly critique Fox News. Do you at least admit that at times, other outlets are guilty of the same exact fallacies? You want to play this as completely one sided and other outlets are squeaky clean, I can assure you that they are not. I don't put a lot of credibility in Fox News, about the same I put into MSNBC and Vox because they are usually guilty of the same fallacies just from different slants.
    It’s really simple. To Guisslapp, FOX slants right, therefore they are evil. Every other mainstream media news network in America slants left, therefore he views them as righteous.

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    Re: Russia

    VOX???? LOL. Now there's some fair and balanced reporting. Just put on your tin foil hat before you read anything they write.

    Pretty much an opinion piece based on conspiracy theories....the new junk food of the left.

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    Re: Russia

    Quote Originally Posted by DawgyNWindow View Post
    VOX???? LOL. Now there's some fair and balanced reporting. Just put on your tin foil hat before you read anything they write.

    Pretty much an opinion piece based on conspiracy theories....the new junk food of the left.
    Did you read it and follow the links? Facts are either substantive or not. They have no bias.

    Bias of authors has no effect on critical evaluation of arguments and propositions. Everyone is biased.

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    Re: Russia

    Quote Originally Posted by DawgyNWindow View Post
    VOX???? LOL. Now there's some fair and balanced reporting. Just put on your tin foil hat before you read anything they write.

    Pretty much an opinion piece based on conspiracy theories....the new junk food of the left.
    Did you read it?

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    Re: Russia

    Quote Originally Posted by Guisslapp View Post
    Did you read it?
    I read through the contention that the DNC server was hacked by the Russians and scanned through the rest (I don't want to pollute my brain with dribble).

    When they start with this unproved, and unprovable, incident, they are full of bull $h1t to begin with. The DNC refused to let the justice department or anyone else do a forensic analysis on the computer (more bleach bitting and ball peen hammering, I guess), so all of that is conjecture. It's just a story.

    Then the implication that Trump called for Wikileaks to hack into data and release it was all BS too. If Trump was such good buddies with the Russians, why not just go to them directly? That was a comment made off the cuff and you know it. To keep hammering on this is just dumb.

    Just to add, I think there are meetings all over the place between candidates and foreign leaders during Presidentail campaigns. It is just normal for people to try to gain favor from a potential US President by kissing his butt prior to the election, and I would bet that this is not the first set of advisors (children and relatives) that have been approached and spoken to on behalf of a government. That's not collusion....it's not even bad.

    I don't even blame Hillary for working with a foreign spy to create a false document on Trump. I am sure that kind of stuff goes on all the time. I do hold the management of the FBI and others responsible for using this information to get a FISA warrant to infiltrate the campaign of a candidate, however. Especially when they KNEW it was campaign garbage to begin with.

    Should I see Russia benefiting overtly (like Iran did during Obama) from dealings with Trump, I will start to worry. Otherwise this is all a big generated nothing to sway American opinion....much like the Obama birth certificate and the fact that he was a Muslim (which I believe, but don't care about one bit).

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    Re: Russia

    Quote Originally Posted by DawgyNWindow View Post
    I read through the contention that the DNC server was hacked by the Russians and scanned through the rest (I don't want to pollute my brain with dribble).

    When they start with this unproved, and unprovable, incident, they are full of bull $h1t to begin with. The DNC refused to let the justice department or anyone else do a forensic analysis on the computer (more bleach bitting and ball peen hammering, I guess), so all of that is conjecture. It's just a story.

    Then the implication that Trump called for Wikileaks to hack into data and release it was all BS too. If Trump was such good buddies with the Russians, why not just go to them directly? That was a comment made off the cuff and you know it. To keep hammering on this is just dumb.
    http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-me...ess-dnc-serve/

    Maybe you missed the fact that this Trump conspiracy theory has already been debunked.

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    Re: Russia

    Quote Originally Posted by Guisslapp View Post
    http://www.politifact.com/truth-o-me...ess-dnc-serve/

    Maybe you missed the fact that this Trump conspiracy theory has already been debunked.
    Politifact is from your tribe (they are dems looking to set the record straight).

    I am amazed at how everyone lets the 24 hour news cycle run their lives. I do not control these investigations. You may feel all omnipotent there in your chair and feel like your opinion carries so much weight, but it doesn't account for a hill of beans. Go back 3 months and see what the crisis was then. How about 3 months before that. The news cycle is running your life (mostly the fake news cycle). I dont pay attention to the garbage you posted any more than I pay attention to Stuart Varney's 4 hour Trump for President commercial every day.

    I refuse to play. Trump is POTUS. I did not vote for him (and I did not vote for Obama or McCain either, and somewhat regret my vote for Romney). At this point I have to just look at whether he is doing a good job FOR AMERICA. I believe he is. You believe he is not. Cry me a river.

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    Re: Russia

    Quote Originally Posted by DawgyNWindow View Post
    I read through the contention that the DNC server was hacked by the Russians and scanned through the rest (I don't want to pollute my brain with dribble).
    I
    When they start with this unproved, and unprovable, incident, they are full of bull $h1t to begin with. The DNC refused to let the justice department or anyone else do a forensic analysis on the computer (more bleach bitting and ball peen hammering, I guess), so all of that is conjecture. It's just a story.

    Then the implication that Trump called for Wikileaks to hack into data and release it was all BS too. If Trump was such good buddies with the Russians, why not just go to them directly? That was a comment made off the cuff and you know it. To keep hammering on this is just dumb.

    Just to add, I think there are meetings all over the place between candidates and foreign leaders during Presidentail campaigns. It is just normal for people to try to gain favor from a potential US President by kissing his butt prior to the election, and I would bet that this is not the first set of advisors (children and relatives) that have been approached and spoken to on behalf of a government. That's not collusion....it's not even bad.

    I don't even blame Hillary for working with a foreign spy to create a false document on Trump. I am sure that kind of stuff goes on all the time. I do hold the management of the FBI and others responsible for using this information to get a FISA warrant to infiltrate the campaign of a candidate, however. Especially when they KNEW it was campaign garbage to begin with.

    Should I see Russia benefiting overtly (like Iran did during Obama) from dealings with Trump, I will start to worry. Otherwise this is all a big generated nothing to sway American opinion....much like the Obama birth certificate and the fact that he was a Muslim (which I believe, but don't care about one bit).
    When you refuse to interact with facts because you’ve already decided what’s true and what’s not, you are consuming news in a biased and discriminatory way. That type of Media consumption (or refusal to consume) is what has given rise to a media culture that makes its money confirming the biases of its readers.

    In short, don’t gripe about the media that you’ve demanded.
    Time is your friend. Impulse is your enemy. -John Bogle

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