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Thread: Flagship University, A diploma factory?

  1. #1
    Champ BhadDawg has a reputation beyond reputeBhadDawg has a reputation beyond reputeBhadDawg has a reputation beyond reputeBhadDawg has a reputation beyond reputeBhadDawg has a reputation beyond reputeBhadDawg has a reputation beyond reputeBhadDawg has a reputation beyond reputeBhadDawg has a reputation beyond reputeBhadDawg has a reputation beyond reputeBhadDawg has a reputation beyond reputeBhadDawg has a reputation beyond repute
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    Thought everyone would find this interesting.

    The article comes from LAPolitics.com, many of you will find that the article agrees with many things this board has been saying for the past three years.

    The article is quite lengthy, but worth a read

    The Evolution of A Diploma Factory:

    The Losing Plight of Instruction at Louisiana’s Flagship Institution of Higher Learning

    Prepared exclusively for Politicsla.com by Dr. Chris Warner

    Over the last five years student enrollment at LSU’s Baton Rouge campus has swelled to over 31,000. Buoyed by a unique and generous Tuition Opportunity Program for Students that annually appropriates over $100 million in state-financed tuition for qualifying Louisiana high school graduates and more recently a nationally successful athletic program, LSU’s classrooms and lecture halls are brimming at unprecedented levels. However, as Louisiana’s Flagship institution has recently added enrollment it has simultaneously reduced instructor levels as part of the “Flagship Agenda” spawned by its now departed chancellor. This exclusive article for Politicsla.com peers into the strained instructional realities that currently attempt to drive the state’s Flagship Institution of Higher Learning as well as its impending pseudo-intellectual fallout.

    From Third Tier to Top Ten Research University

    In October, 2003, it was announced that LSU, which is ranked among the third tier of United States public institutions of higher learning by U.S. News & World Report, would be making a concerted move towards reducing its number of instructors in order to replace them with more tenure-track or terminally degreed professors (those with Ph.D.’s). The move, according to the university brass, was and is essential in making LSU a premier research university in the South, one compatible with the likes of the University of North Carolina within the famed Research Triangle Park of Raleigh-Durham, North Carolina.

    The premise driving this flagship movement is that premier research universities in America create business and economic development for their host states by simply immersing intellectual capital into an environment that encourages the fomenting of entrepreneurial ideas. However, there is no substantive proof that “research” universities indeed create economic development for their host cities and states simply by physical juxtaposition. Businesses are not regularly created as a result of academics conducting research. To believe otherwise is a real world fallacy. Economic development has more to do with a fair tax policy, sound infrastructure, a quality of life that is attractive to raise a family and wide-ranging educational opportunities than it does academic research.

    As the Flagship Agenda has been methodically implemented over the past six months it has resulted in necessary instructor attrition to make way for the more costly Ph.D.’s that are now teaching enormous classes ranging into the hundreds. Disciplines like English and Mathematics are now introduced to entering freshman in classroom sizes of three and sometimes four hundred students or more. Other classes like introductory Psychology in the Cox Communications Auditorium boast nearly 1,000 students. This is all necessary under the Flagship Agenda, according to LSU, so that the school can become a top-flight research institution by attracting brilliant minds from across the country to conduct their research under the stately oaks and broad magnolias in Baton Rouge.

    Detractors of the flagship movement contend that it is quietly denuding LSU of its most reliable predictor for learning and growth—quality instruction. They say that large lecture classes are not the way to go because many college kids don’t respond well to the impersonal setting that virtually negates the all-important teacher-student relationship. Many LSU students value the instructor-pupil relationship and have spoken out strongly against the flagship agenda imposed by the departing chancellor. The following appeared in the LSU Daily Reveille in March, 2004:

    Dear Editor:

    As a student of LSU I feel that the plans to increase the sizes of our English and Math classes are a very bad idea. In my opinion college level Math and English are not only the most challenging courses we face as students, but also the most important. These are the classes that require a close relationship between student and teacher, something that is virtually impossible in the auditorium classroom setting.

    Those of us who have taken classes in the Cox Communications auditorium for example, know that it is nearly impossible to ask a question in class, or even after class for that matter. This is due directly to the huge number of students enrolled in the class. We the students have more power than anyone does at LSU; this is an issue we all need to speak up on.

    The increase in the size of our English and math courses, if made into a reality, will be damaging to the University as well as its students. Grades and attendance rates will inevitably fall in the most important classes of our lives as a result.

    Paul Gonsoulin, Freshman, Mass Communication

    Beer & Circus

    Dr. Murray Sperber of the University of Indiana Bloomington has written a compelling book titled Beer and Circus: How Big-time College Sports Is Crippling Undergraduate Education (2000, Henry Holt & Co.). In his provocative treatise Sperber exposes what he calls “renegade chancellors and college presidents” for selfishly “striving for research fame, neglecting undergraduate education, and promoting their college sports franchises.” When reading Dr. Sperber’s gripping book last fall I could not help but recognize the many parallels between LSU and the many other public universities described within. LSU, like the schools critiqued, had a renegade chancellor that craftily negotiated a 72% pay raise against the working papers of the school, the LSU Board of Supervisors and the Tiger Athletic Foundation, which provided an annual cash bonus payment to the chancellor for serving the institution. This chancellor, undoubtedly a “team” player, equivocally stated, “Simply put, success in LSU football is essential for the success of Louisiana State University!” In doing so he made a strong case for fortifying the athletic department. Unfortunately, progress in the areas of research and athletics have occurred at the expense of undergraduate instruction because as university administrators focus on building research faculties and facilities and winning sports programs, like Sperber candidly says, “The undergraduates get the shaft.”

    Hundreds of Students Per Class

    Under the Flagship Agenda LSU aims to ostensibly “…increase the number of tenure-track faculty, while maintaining instructional quality and capacity.” However, in order to increase tenure-track faculty, LSU has had to severely diminish the number of instructors that the university formerly relied on to teach these important entry-level courses. Thus the reason for the excessively large classroom sizes, and the many graduate student teaching assistants that are needed to aid in the grading of papers and multiple guess exams. Another point detractors of the flagship agenda continually cite is that using many different grad assistants to grade papers is unfair because grading becomes inconsistent as a result since students’ papers are graded by many different grad assistants that each grade differently.

    With the beginnings of its transition into its Flagship Agenda LSU has communicated firmly through action that it intends to be a research university instead of one that boasts quality undergraduate instruction. Research universities tend to focus on and support graduate school efforts while undergraduate curriculums and students invariably suffer by buying into the myth that great researchers make great instructors for our undergraduates. The truth is that the two titles are independent of one another, and not directly correlated in any way. Patrick Terenzini and Ernest Pascarella, further elaborate in another Beer And Circus excerpt:

    “The available empirical evidence calls the “good-researcher=good teacher” argument sharply into question…scholarly productivity and instructional effectiveness have less than 2 percent…in common. That means that about 98 percent of the variability in measures of instructional effectiveness is due to something other than research productivity.”

    Large classes are not uncommon at large American public universities like LSU. However, during the last five years LSU’s enrollment has swelled due to TOPS and a winning football team. Therefore the most recent “Flagship Agenda” move to eliminate instructors has had a compounding effect on undergraduate classroom sizes, making class time more crowded and contradicting than ever. Unfortunately for the LSU undergraduate student bent on learning, in this case big is not always better. Patrick Terenzini and Ernest Pascarella, both educators, explain, as excerpted from Dr. Sperber’s book, Beer And Circus:

    “At a freshman psychology lecture we attended, 300 students were still finding seats when the professor started talking. “Today,” he said into a microphone, “we will continue our discussion of learning.” He might as well have been addressing a crowd in a Greyhound bus terminal. Like commuters marking time until their next departure, students in this class alternately read the newspaper, flipped through a paperback novel, or propped their feet on the chairs ahead of them, staring into space.”

    Enrollment by Level and Gender
    Fall 1994 through Fall 2003 (http://www.lsu.edu)

    The Importance Of Quality Instruction

    When LSU’s former chancellor emphatically stated that “Simply put, success in LSU football is essential for the success of Louisiana State University!” he inspired an unparalleled commitment of the manpower and resources of the state’s flagship institution of higher learning to winning in football. This movement was spurred by the hiring of head football coach Nick Saban, in 1999, for $1.2 million per year. Nick Saban was known as a “hands-on” coach, a tireless teacher of defensive secondary tactics and formations. Saban routinely works one-on-one with his players, instilling in each aspects of his own character, drive and personality. Through word and deed he is molding each young man into a winner through caring contact, assistance and guidance. On the LSU football field, the student-teacher relationship flourishes and it has brought great dividends. Unfortunately, the same cannot be said regarding inside the halls of LSU academics. Within overcrowded lecture rooms few opportunities exist for students to get to know their professors, since they are vying for a professor’s attention alongside hundreds of other classmates. At LSU, winning instruction on the football field is not matched by winning instruction in the classroom, and it is a direct result of the priorities of its now departed leader.

    Exploding The Myth That Winning In Football Makes A Great University

    In his influential early-1960s book, The Uses of the University, Clark Kerr, the president of the University of California system, examined the established Ivy League schools like Harvard, Princeton and Yale against the up-and-coming schools vying for what Sperber refers to as “research prestige.” Kerr noted the following:

    “…the mark of a university ‘on the make’ is a mad scramble for football stars and professorial luminaries. The former do little studying and the latter little teaching, and so they form a neat combination of muscle and intellect…” Sperber in Beer And Circus, added that this “keeps the faculty and the college kids happy,” and that “the administrators who create this conjunction between football and faculty stars do well: they bring fame and fortune to their schools and they enhance their jobs.”

    Kerr added in his book that universities “on the make” that used intercollegiate athletics as public entertainment created an unavoidable by-product, what he referred to as “a superior research faculty that results in an inferior concern for undergraduate teaching.”

    LSU’s departed chancellor often justified his overzealous approach towards supporting athletics by saying that success on the athletic courts and fields brought great notoriety and prestige to the university. Dr. Murray Sperber calls this specious line of academic reasoning “The Flutie Factor,” named after former Boston College quarterback Doug Flutie, the heaver of the famed “Hail Mary” pass that defeated a heavily favored Miami team in the closing seconds of a 1984 contest. The applications for admissions into Boston College rose 25 percent the year following Flutie’s spectacular flight into the sacred annals of college football history. LSU, one could argue, may experience a similar increase in admission applications as a result of its recent national championship in football, its first in 45 years. However, while the school’s ultra-loyal fan base basks in the long-awaited championship light, dedicated academicians and students futilely await the fulfillment of the chancellor’s prophecy—that success in academics is predicated by success in athletics.

    Winning in Football And A Rise In The Party School Atmosphere

    While winning in big-time athletics brings great recognition to an institution, Sperber says that there are nevertheless resulting negative repercussions. Sperber insists that the party atmosphere on college campuses increases as a result of the Flutie Factor, since students are drawn to the “hotness” of the school, defined by its “expanding sports fame” and burgeoning Animal House party scene. If this development proves true in Baton Rouge—then LSU will soon once again regain its lofty status as the undisputed “Number One Party School in America” as published annually in Playboy’s legendary Party School Rankings. In April, 2004, Playboy listed LSU fourth on its list of the nation’s Top 25 Party Schools. Ironically, during the tenure of LSU’s departed chancellor, he campaigned tirelessly against LSU’s party culture and mentality, denouncing publicly previous high party school rankings for LSU by Playboy and Princeton Review. Nevertheless, through his inexcusable actions of promoting football at the expense of instruction the chancellor was neutralizing his efforts by ostensibly facilitating the pervasive “Beer And Circus” mentality among the student body.

    A True Flagship of Higher Education For Louisiana

    In August, 1988, I enrolled as a freshman on academic scholarship at LSU in Baton Rouge. During that year LSU initiated, under the leadership of its chancellor, Dr. James Wharton, a bold program to raise admission requirements. For the first time in many years, LSU was no longer an “Open Admissions” university—one that would allow almost any level of student. Freshman English and Math classes averaged 15 to 25 people per class, respectively. I remember my teachers, their names, their backgrounds and their personalities. LSU has changed in 15 years—for the worse regarding the undergraduate looking for an education. LSU must change its policies if it is to change its effect on the population as a molder of young men and women. Under its current educational practices LSU is a de facto “Diploma Factory” that is annually churning out thousands of pseudo-intellectuals that think they have what it takes to reach self-actualization, that elusive psychological pinnacle aptly defined by Abraham Maslow.

    Maslow was a psychologist who studied human motivation. Maslow's great insight and contribution to his field was to place actualization into a hierarchy of motivation. Self-actualization, as he called it, is the highest drive, but before a person can turn to it, he or she must satisfy other, lower motivations like hunger, safety and belonging. The hierarchy developed by Maslow has five levels. They are as follows:

    1. 1. Physiological (hunger, thirst, shelter, sex, etc.)

    2. 2. Safety (security, protection from physical and emotional harm)

    3. 3. Social (affection, belonging, acceptance, friendship)

    4. 4. Esteem (also called ego). The internal ones are self respect, autonomy, achievement and the external ones are status, recognition, attention.

    5. 5. Self actualization (doing things toward becoming the best you can be)

    Quality of life researcher Dr. Joseph Sirgy of Virgina Tech University, in his “Quality of Life Theory based on Maslow’s Hierarchy of Needs,” suggests that governments bent on improving the plight of its people should strive to create a higher-ordered society, or one that has a high percentage of its people reaching self-actualization. This, Sirgy insisted, could occur by investing resources into education so that people might once-and-for-all transcend their lesser needs within the structured hierarchy in exchange for self-actualization and ultimately, success in life.

    If one believes strongly that quality instruction is an essential part of the educational process, then one certainly sees the need for a change in policy at Louisiana State University. LSU is and will always be my alma mater. As a young man from a small, rural southwestern Louisiana town, LSU was a country boy’s dream. I received a great education for life there and while I was in Baton Rouge I made many friends and forged countless fond memories that will remain with me for a lifetime. We owe our posterity that same opportunity—to attend a public university that values quality instruction as an integral part in the successful education of its student customers.

    As the TOPS program continues to provide qualifying high school graduates with a choice of where they will attend college in Louisiana, many will choose LSU. In order for LSU to become and maintain a distinction of a true flagship institution of higher learning, it will need to honor the student-teacher relationship by hiring more instructors with master’s degrees and by simultaneously increasing admission standards for the university. LSU’s enrollment levels have topped 30,000 and are where they were during the late eighties when the school was an Open Admissions university. A true flagship must be more selective in its enrollment. One other recommendation would be to increase the requirements for the TOPS scholarship, which is undoubtedly fueling the campus’ rapid growth.

    Louisiana State University is a treasure to all of its alumni and fans. In essence, LSU personifies the very best that the State of Louisiana has to offer and is every bit deserving of its moniker as the flagship university. In that vein, LSU alumni need always remember the end of the school’s alma mater and its ephemeral plea for faithful allegiance among its alumni base:

    “ Our worth in life will be thy worth, we pray to keep it true, And may thy spirit live in us, forever LSU.”

    *note - opinions expressed in editorial columns on this site do not necessarily reflect the views of PoliticsLA.com. Comments can be sent to editor@politicsla.com.

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  2. #2
    Varsity Bulldog yobrefstank has turned a few heads around hereyobrefstank has turned a few heads around here yobrefstank's Avatar
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    Interesting reading......but as long as Championships keep rolling in, nothing will change at LSU A&M.

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    You know you're in trouble when a MASS COMMUNICATION major says your class is too big.... :lol:

  4. #4
    Champ dawg80 has a reputation beyond reputedawg80 has a reputation beyond reputedawg80 has a reputation beyond reputedawg80 has a reputation beyond reputedawg80 has a reputation beyond reputedawg80 has a reputation beyond reputedawg80 has a reputation beyond reputedawg80 has a reputation beyond reputedawg80 has a reputation beyond reputedawg80 has a reputation beyond reputedawg80 has a reputation beyond repute dawg80's Avatar
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    I have a very good friend who is trying to enter the PhD program at Tech in finance. He was told that he needed a minimum 570 on the GMAT to meet entry requirements. He scored a 590 and thought he had that part made.

    Well, he just learned he needs to retake the GMAT because Tech expects to have three openings in the Fall, and there are many other applicants for the program with GMAT scores way up in the 600's and higher. I don't know, but I suspect Tech uses a sliding scale of GMAT/GPA in your Master's Program, to give the applicant a "score."

    My buddy has been visiting with the grad admissions folks at Tech for about a year, trying to enter several programs (economics, for instance) and he keeps getting beaten out. He could EASILY enter other schools in the state and region, but KNOWS Tech has the best program. So, he'll keep trying.

    BTW, he is from Europe with no previous connection to Tech.

    As the flagship wallows, the Tech schooner sails by!

  5. #5
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    If LSU is the state's flagship, they better start paddling because that ship is not getting anywhere fast. I am in law school down here at LSU after graduated Tech engineering. A few other engineers are in school down here. One in particular started off at Tech and then transferred to LSU. He said the difficulty at Tech compared to LSU is like night and day. Besides life sciences and mass comm, I don't know of a single program at LSU that is as good or better than Tech's.

  6. #6
    Varsity Bulldog Tech74 is an unknown
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    Quote Originally Posted by dawg80
    I have a very good friend who is trying to enter the PhD program at Tech in finance. He was told that he needed a minimum 570 on the GMAT to meet entry requirements. He scored a 590 and thought he had that part made.

    Well, he just learned he needs to retake the GMAT because Tech expects to have three openings in the Fall, and there are many other applicants for the program with GMAT scores way up in the 600's and higher. I don't know, but I suspect Tech uses a sliding scale of GMAT/GPA in your Master's Program, to give the applicant a "score."

    My buddy has been visiting with the grad admissions folks at Tech for about a year, trying to enter several programs (economics, for instance) and he keeps getting beaten out. He could EASILY enter other schools in the state and region, but KNOWS Tech has the best program. So, he'll keep trying.

    BTW, he is from Europe with no previous connection to Tech.

    As the flagship wallows, the Tech schooner sails by!

    Don't be so sure. The Tech admin is also infatuated with the idea of becoming a "research school" and is refusing to hire nontenure track profs so as to pay the researchers. This is a problem I've been told about for several years by faculty friends. I'm really worried about this but maybe the problems at LSU and other schools will put us back in the direction of instructional quality as the most important thing. We DO NOT and NEVER WILL have the resources to conduct basic research. BS research is not worth sacrificing one excellent English 101 instructor over.

  7. #7
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    I remember that the College of Engineering tried the research gig when some dude named Wimberly was dean back in the early 1980's. I do not believe it went over very well then and was soon abandoned. Who is the current dean?

    I hope Louisiana Tech University stays true to itself and chooses to teach students instead of chasing reasearch rainbows. Hell, I would even oppose research agronomy!

  8. #8
    Varsity Bulldog Tech74 is an unknown
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    I don't think it was abandonded, I think it was put on hold during the budget crises of the time. Wimberly was a disaster, as I recall, but my memory may be faulty. It's funny how having kids in the 80's directed my attention away from the important things in life like college politics.

  9. #9
    Champ dawg80 has a reputation beyond reputedawg80 has a reputation beyond reputedawg80 has a reputation beyond reputedawg80 has a reputation beyond reputedawg80 has a reputation beyond reputedawg80 has a reputation beyond reputedawg80 has a reputation beyond reputedawg80 has a reputation beyond reputedawg80 has a reputation beyond reputedawg80 has a reputation beyond reputedawg80 has a reputation beyond repute dawg80's Avatar
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    My bud is not trying to become a member of Tech's faculty, he is currently teaching at NSU. But he needs that terminal degree (PhD) and NSU needs another finance PhD. He is currently adjunct and also runs a small business in town.

    The dean of NSU's business school is the one pushing him and several others who currently hold master's to pursue a PhD at Tech. Their other options include North Texas and ULL, which would be fine, but the dean is encouraging them to get into Tech's programs.

    My wife just completed her PhD at LSU, as did several other close friends of mine. I am NOT just pi$$ing in the wind here. When I say that Tech, in particular, has really raised the bar, you can bank it. In fairness, LSU has recently raised the bar too, and in fact, my wife's pursuit of her PhD dragged out for 2 additional years because they suddenly became more demanding.

  10. #10
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    This problem is not new, and it is not unique to LSU. A number of universities are facing an identity crisis and are under a lot of pressure from a lot of different sources to engage in research, hoping to make some groundbreaking discovery that will yield big bucks for the school and get it's name in the newspapers and on CNN. This was not an issue at LSU until Mark Emmert showed up as Chancellor and pushed through the Flagship Agenda, which emphasized research and tenure-track/ terminal degree faculty seasoned in research as a way to help LSU build a national reputation. I have no problem with this; research can be very good for a university and it's good to have a lot of experienced, renowned Ph.D.'s at your college. We are trying to improve our percentages in a very sneaky way though; instead of going out and hiring more Ph.D. profs, we're simply firing all of our professors who don't have at least a Master's degree in their field. That's what has got the English and Math departments up in arms. The PhD's aren't going to be teaching MATH 1023 classes either; those classes will fall to graduate assistants. It is foolish to throw away all these instructors, many of whom have years of experience teaching, simply because they don't hold a terminal degree or engage in big-budget research.

    I feel we are also doing this for the wrong reasons. Don't get me wrong, I love Chancellor Emmert. I definitely believe that, when he leaves here in June, he will have left LSU in far better shape than he found it. The problem I have with Chancellor Emmert is that he and the core group of academics around him pushing LSU in this direction have become so obsessed with big-time research dollars and where LSU is ranked in the annual U.S. News & World Report Collegiate Rankings List that he is losing sight of what LSU is supposed to be here for; educating young men and women and preparing them to be outstanding citizens and professionals in their chosen field. That is all that is motivating our policy with regards to the professors; they think that a higher ratio of Ph.D. professors will raise our rankings on that list. I have unfortunate news for Dr. Emmert and his inner circle; it won't. The USNWR rankings are notorious for their bi-coastal prejudice; they give very little respect to any public universities outside of California and the Northeast, and they are least impressed by those in the Deep South. Why should we even care what they think anyway? As long as we are making the best effort we can with regards to funding our universities and staffing them with competent, caring leaders and teachers, I will believe in in Louisiana's higher education system and put it up against any other in the nation (but just as an aside, our higher education system has a lot of problems right now, and I know we can do better). Let USNWR keep shoving their "Ivy League and Berkeley" crap down everyone's throat like they always have been. It is long past time to start ignoring them. Their rankings certainly shouldn't be allowed to influence policy at any university.

    As for the party school rankings; there is absolutely no hard data involved in that at all; just something publications do for fun. And we've been dropping like a rock in the party rankings since I got here anyway. Can you get your fair share of partying in at LSU? Sure you can, just like at any other university in the country (except maybe Tech, because Ruston has passed a law banning fun and the RPD brutally enforces that law ) But the facts on the ground do not always support the belief that LSU is an “Animal House” campus, such as the fact that in the last few years, administration here has harshly cracked down on the Greek system, revoking the charters of many fraternities who have been here for decades and enforced a new, stricter code of conduct for Greeks.

    What about LSU’s athletic success? I will concede one possible way that might hurt LSU; the average Louisianian, who only cares about sports, might see that LSU is winning lots of championships and assume that everything is just peachy-keen at the university, in all facets, when in reality we might not be such a championship caliber school academically. Of course, isn’t this true with all schools everywhere; that the average fan doesn’t care about the Physics department’s national accreditation as long as BCS bowls and Final Fours keep rollin’ in? Again, a problem that is not new and not unique to LSU. Other than that, the author smells and sounds like another pointy-headed academic upset about society’s love of athletics and determined to yet again scream the ridiculous myth that top-notch athletics (football in particular) and top-notch academics cannot co-exist on the same campus. That is a lie, and you need look no further than Duke and Stanford to see that it is. LSU’s athletic success has, in my opinion, been very good for the university, in bringing us increased revenue and valuable free PR and advertising. How does the saying go, “Athletics is the window through which the world views a university.” It’s true, and I think the view the world gets of LSU is pretty good right now and can only help us. Now, I want LSU to be a top-notch academic institution, and if I thought for one minute that our athletic program was an obstacle to that, I would be the first to call for a reassessment. But I honestly don’t think it is; I believe we can have both.

    As far as the comparisons to Tech and LSU, I have not taken any classes at Tech, so I don’t have a frame of reference. I can only go by word of mouth. But my word of mouth is different from what others have said on this thread. I’ve known several friends from high school who started at Tech and came to LSU, and a few who started at LSU and came back home to go to Tech. To a man, they said it was harder to succeed academically at LSU than it was at Tech. Now let me clarify my remarks before you all get good and hot and rise up to shout me down in defense of your alma mater. They did not all say that the curriculum at LSU was more challenging than that at La. Tech (although a few did say that). Many said that the environment was just different at LSU, larger classes, more “distant” professors, more responsibility for making your own way (some thought of it as being given just enough rope to hang themselves), whereas Tech was smaller classes, professors who gave one-on-one instruction and bent over backwards to help you out, a more sheltered setting. Some did say at LSU they felt like just a number (I’ve never felt that way but I can see how some would). Some said the course emphasis and requirements were different, and in some cases harder, than at Tech. A little background on this as well; none of the people I talked to about this were engineering or “hard science” majors, which is Tech’s bread-n-butter; they were all humanities or business majors. It was the humanities majors who were more inclined to say LSU was harder than Tech, while the business folks said the two schools were about the same but that they liked Tech because of the smaller, scaled-down, more sheltered and supportive learning environment. The C.B.A. at LSU has a reputation of being very competitive, cut-throat, sink-or-swim, “every man for himself” environment, so I can believe that. For me there was little choice when I was choosing schools; Tech did not offer the course of study I wanted to major in, but LSU did. Also, none of the LSU-to-Tech transfers flunked out at LSU and were sent home to North Louisiana in disgrace, then just picked up at Tech making 4.0s. That NEVER happens. I don’t care if you go to Harvard or Nicholls State, a 4.0 is hard anywhere and you have to work for that. Likewise, none of the Tech-to-LSU transfers said Tech was a complete joke and they were “looking for a challenge.” All transferred for their own reasons; LSU had the program of study they really wanted and they just did a year or two at Tech to save money; Tech and Ruston were a little too “small-townish” for them and they wanted a change in scenery; or they went down to LSU, it wasn’t what they thought it would be, they got really homesick and came back to Tech. Of course, I can’t confirm any of this; I didn’t pry into their personal affairs and I didn’t get to compare their transcripts from the two schools; this is all just from talking to these people. Word-of-mouth.

    Also, since Tech is a smaller university that is not a Research I institution and doesn’t have a national reputation for cutting-edge research (not knockin’ Tech, guys, just stating a fact) the pressure at Tech to do these things is no doubt not as severe. But I find it hard to believe there is no pressure at all for research and for climbing the academic rankings at La. Tech. I remember well the last Engineering Day I went to at Tech back in 1999 and we took a tour of the Institute for Micro-Manufacturing, and the guy giving us the tour who was the assistant director of the institute, if memory serves me right, went on and on and on about the huge research grants the institute had landed and how it was helping broaden Tech’s academic horizons and further the school’s reputation. This mentality is everywhere right now. Whether or not Tech is willing to start sacrificing instruction in favor of research I can’t say. But obviously, some impetus to engage in research is there. I do hope that Dr. Reneau is not as obsessed with the USNWR collegiate rankings as Chancellor Emmert has been. He should not even waste time with trying to please those pinhead Yankee snobs and just keep on doing what he’s been doing, on the academic side at least. Hopefully, our new chancellor will concern himself with tangible, real-world results and not rankings in a magazine to measure LSU’s academic prowess.

  11. #11
    Champ THEarmada has a reputation beyond reputeTHEarmada has a reputation beyond reputeTHEarmada has a reputation beyond reputeTHEarmada has a reputation beyond reputeTHEarmada has a reputation beyond reputeTHEarmada has a reputation beyond reputeTHEarmada has a reputation beyond reputeTHEarmada has a reputation beyond reputeTHEarmada has a reputation beyond reputeTHEarmada has a reputation beyond reputeTHEarmada has a reputation beyond repute THEarmada's Avatar
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    LSU is still very much a party school. Of the half of my graduating class (2003) that went to LSU, prolly more than half of those have had serious problems with partying. Most have them have become pot heads.

  12. #12
    Champ killerdawg is just really nicekillerdawg is just really nicekillerdawg is just really nicekillerdawg is just really nicekillerdawg is just really nicekillerdawg is just really nicekillerdawg is just really nicekillerdawg is just really nicekillerdawg is just really nicekillerdawg is just really nicekillerdawg is just really nice killerdawg's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Tech74
    We DO NOT and NEVER WILL have the resources to conduct basic research. BS research is not worth sacrificing one excellent English 101 instructor over.
    I was Research Contracts Administrator for Tech in 97/98 and virtually all of their research was basic research then. There was some done in partnership with ul-br, but that was the exception.

    Are you saying that situation has changed since 98?

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