POTUS 2008 - Dogby Poll

[JuBru]

have you ever seen anything that says that they don't?

(i don't mean to gang up on you, but i want to understand your point of view)

I have only seen the ways in, not the ways out.

[arkansasbob]

If I could remember the name of the bases, I would tell you. But look at the downsizing that happened when Bush 1 signed the treaty with Russia about downsizing, then Clinton came in and downsized more. The overall decommisioning of ships, bases, personnel, and other things ended up costing more than to keep them in service, as it cost more. And then when the build up again (foretold to politicians that it would happen before Clinton downsized and was told it was a bad thing to do), the added cost of recommisioning and setting everything up again added to the cost.
No, I do not have the exact nubmers on hand either, lost through time.

i think you've missed my point. for years, we have closed bases at home, while maintaining bases abroad. i don't see what decomissioning ships has to do with closing foreign bases. we can be stronger and much more efficient if our resources are more concentrated at home.

[arkansasbob]

If his reasoning for getting the gun is to kill me, then yes... Yeah, I know, it's against the law, but as individuals... A country can a does exert that "right," and America hasn't been the only one to do it, just the most noticeable and publicized (thanks to modern technology)

it would be immoral for you to attack your neighbor just because you heard a rumor that he wanted to kill you. that which is immoral for individuals is immoral for states.

[arkansasbob]

I have only seen the ways in, not the ways out.

so, naturally, you assume that the only way out is by war?

[JuBru]

3rd question......

"Such is the world of militaristic minds."

What precisely is a "militaristic mind"......
And WHY have you opted to "train" your little grey cells below any such concept.
Or have you already qualifed yourself as a "militaristic mind" of note?

Can you name only THREE MILITARISTIC MINDS in the history of man who have DONE GOOD without leaving a long trail of HUMAN DEATH AND DESTRUCTION in their WAR WAKES?

As the COMMANDER IN CHIEF of the only SUPERPOWER left standing on our tiny planet......
Is little george a "militaristic mind", whom YOU deem worthy of YOUR absolute allegiance and support?

I'm not of note. Just have my views and opinions.

Not at the moment. Would have to do a little research.

No, he's not.

[JuBru]

i think you've missed my point. for years, we have closed bases at home, while maintaining bases abroad. i don't see what decomissioning ships has to do with closing foreign bases. we can be stronger and much more efficient if our resources are more concentrated at home.

I know your point. But I don't see it as being that simple or clear cut. There is a necessity to have bases elsewhere, just not as many as we do (I have already stated this somewhere recently).

it would be immoral for you to attack your neighbor just because you heard a rumor that he wanted to kill you. that which is immoral for individuals is immoral for states.

Only if I did it solely based off the rumor. And I do believe in shooting to wound before shooting to kill.

so, naturally, you assume that the only way out is by war?

No... Collapse of government. Collapse ends all debate as each state is then on it's own to make it's own decision on what to do. They have that right now, but within the contextof the federal government as the states are states of the Union and are recognized as such, not as individual states (except for maybe Texas).

[Spinoza]

That is a somewhat bias and loaded question. I never said it killed more people than war, just that more are killed needlessly when war is preventable, and sometimes that involves killing.

As I KNOW and you should KNOW......
My query was neither biased or loaded.

It was merely a logical effort to call your prior statement to task.
But rather than answer a more than simple question......
You have now opted to maintain that "waiting"/NO WAR kills human beings "needlessly"......
While implying the REAL WAR is somehow ABOVE any such honest consideration.

BOTTOM LINE......
Rusty is unable to reference any instance throughout the entire history of mankind when "waiting"/NO WAR has EVER resulted in more human DEATH than the alternative of WAR......
But Rusty still prefers WAR (while never participating in ANY WAR) over NO WAR.

[JuBru]

BOTTOM LINE......
Rusty is unable to reference any instance throughout the entire history of mankind when "waiting"/NO WAR has EVER resulted in more human DEATH than the alternative of WAR......
But Rusty still prefers WAR (while never participating in ANY WAR) over NO WAR.

That's not what you asked for.



And you are applying my words to situations I never mentioned my words apply to.

[JuBru]

I did suffer from a lost post...

Armenia
Yugoslavia
Russia under Stalin...


And to give you an example of what I mean with the statement I made as what I meant and not what your trying to twist it into - look at WW2.

[Spinoza]

No, real evidence... And evidence can only be based off the meritand context of what it is. There isn't any set parameters to follow other than obtaining the evidence and declaring it real or false.

Hitler's rise and everything related is an example of something preventable, that was ignored.

Lincoln exerted the federal government correctly when bringing the states that succeeded back to the Union. I haven't seen anything that says states have the right to break away.

AND SO IT GOES......
"So much as a shred of evidence" is now replaced by "NO, real evidence"...... But Rusty remains undaunted in his FERVENT CERTAINTY...... Without "parameters"!

[JuBru]

AND SO IT GOES......
"So much as a shred of evidence" is now replaced by "NO, real evidence"...... But Rusty remains undaunted in his FERVENT CERTAINTY...... Without "parameters"!

This is what you want me to say - one piece of paper that shows it is happening... is that what you want? Because your not going to get that. I will not set myself to a specific standard as each situation is unique and can only be handled in it's own way. There is no parameters beyond is it a threat or not.

[Spinoza]

I'm not of note. Just have my views and opinions.

Not at the moment. Would have to do a little research.

No, he's not.

If you have only your subjective"VIEWS AND OPINIONS"......
Why is it that you pretend to post ex cathedra each time you touch a frail finger to your kinetic keyboard?

You interest me because of your obvious proclivity for honesty......
But I am unable to conclude that you would be unwilling to GOOSE STEP under ANY flag that might wave over any accident of birth.

Good night.

[JuBru]

If you have only your subjective"VIEWS AND OPINIONS"......
Why is it that you pretend to post ex cathedra each time you touch a frail finger to your kinetic keyboard?

You interest me because of your obvious proclivity for honesty......
But I am unable to conclude that you would be unwilling to GOOSE STEP under ANY flag that might wave over any accident of birth.

Good night.

There's not an entity on this Earth that I would do that blindly.

[TYLERTECHSAS]

Aw shucks, Tyler, well I coulda guessed that one. There's no sell job in the world that could convince me Huckabee is qualified to be anything other than a Baptist preacher or a spokesperson for TrimSpa. (which in SOME (not all) cases, are one and the same....selling something that can be bad for you)

I'm really not thrilled with the GOP field. I'm pretty wishy washy, at this time, to be honest. I also like Fred Thompson with Huckabee; either on top. And I started out pulling for Rudy until I learned a tad more about him. But then again I wish Newt would have kept his private life in order and he would have been running this time around. Oh well. As they say, "It is what it is". But I do know one thing. I will vote for ABC (Anybody But Clinton)!

["T"]

This should sway the 62% of the non Huckabee supporters:



http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=EjYv2YW6azE


"T"