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Thread: More on the coming Health Care Shortage...

  1. #31
    Champ TYLERTECHSAS has a reputation beyond reputeTYLERTECHSAS has a reputation beyond reputeTYLERTECHSAS has a reputation beyond reputeTYLERTECHSAS has a reputation beyond reputeTYLERTECHSAS has a reputation beyond reputeTYLERTECHSAS has a reputation beyond reputeTYLERTECHSAS has a reputation beyond reputeTYLERTECHSAS has a reputation beyond reputeTYLERTECHSAS has a reputation beyond reputeTYLERTECHSAS has a reputation beyond reputeTYLERTECHSAS has a reputation beyond repute
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    Re: More on the coming Health Care Shortage...

    Let's face it. This Obama dude can lie with the best of them and keep a straight face. IMHO, he's even up there with the Slickmeister.

  2. #32
    Champ DogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond repute DogtorEvil's Avatar
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    Re: More on the coming Health Care Shortage...

    Common Sense May Sink ObamaCare
    It turns out the president misjudged the nation’s mood.

    http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...556532364.html

    This is big, what’s happening. President Obama appears to have misstepped on a major initiative and defining issue. He has misjudged the nation’s mood, which itself is news: He rose from nothing to everything with the help of his fine-tuned antennae. Resistance to the Democratic health-care plans is in the air, showing up more now on YouTube than in the polls, but it will be in the polls soon enough. The president, in short, may be facing a real loss.

    His news conference the other night was bad. He was filibustery and spinny and gave long and largely unfollowable answers that seemed aimed at limiting the number of questions asked and running out the clock. You don’t do that when you’re fully confident. Far more seriously, he didn’t seem to be telling the truth. We need to create a new national health-care program in order to cut down on government spending? Who would believe that? Would anybody?

    think the plan is being slowed and may well be stopped not by ideology, or even by philosophy in a strict sense, but by simple American common sense.

    Americans are not in a chance-taking mood. They’re not in a spending mood, not after the unprecedented spending of the past year, from the end of the Bush era through the first six months of Obama. Here the Congressional Budget Office report that a health care bill would not save money but would instead cost more than a trillion dollars in the next decade was decisive. People say bureaucrats never do anything. The bureaucrats of CBO might have killed health care.
    Originally Posted by champion110
    I am less angry this morning and ready to get back up on the horse. That girl was a freak last night.

    Originally Posted by champion110
    In fact, I finally had to tell her to stop over the last weekend, because I was worn out and needed a break.

  3. #33
    Dawg Adamant Argument Czar Guisslapp has a reputation beyond reputeGuisslapp has a reputation beyond reputeGuisslapp has a reputation beyond reputeGuisslapp has a reputation beyond reputeGuisslapp has a reputation beyond reputeGuisslapp has a reputation beyond reputeGuisslapp has a reputation beyond reputeGuisslapp has a reputation beyond reputeGuisslapp has a reputation beyond reputeGuisslapp has a reputation beyond reputeGuisslapp has a reputation beyond repute Guisslapp's Avatar
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    Re: More on the coming Health Care Shortage...

    People who were once romantically in love with the idea of Obama are s l o w l y starting to get it.
    Jordan Mills on choosing Tech:
    “It’s a great experience seeing them play. It was a good atmosphere. The fans stood up the whole game and never sat down. They have a great fan base.”

  4. #34
    Champ DogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond repute DogtorEvil's Avatar
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    Re: More on the coming Health Care Shortage...

    Quote Originally Posted by Guisslapp View Post
    People who were once romantically in love with the idea of Obama are s l o w l y starting to get it.
    Peggy Noonan voted for BHO.....
    Originally Posted by champion110
    I am less angry this morning and ready to get back up on the horse. That girl was a freak last night.

    Originally Posted by champion110
    In fact, I finally had to tell her to stop over the last weekend, because I was worn out and needed a break.

  5. #35
    Champ DogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond repute DogtorEvil's Avatar
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    Re: More on the coming Health Care Shortage...

    Why Obamacare Is Sinking

    What happened to Obamacare? Rhetoric met reality. As both candidate and president, the master rhetorician could conjure a world in which he bestows upon you health-care nirvana: more coverage, less cost.

    But you can't fake it in legislation. Once you commit your fantasies to words and numbers, the Congressional Budget Office comes along and declares that the emperor has no clothes.

    President Obama premised the need for reform on the claim that medical costs are destroying the economy. True. But now we learn -- surprise! -- that universal coverage increases costs. The congressional Democrats' health-care plans, says the CBO, increase costs on the order of $1 trillion plus.

    In response, the president retreated to a demand that any bill he sign be revenue-neutral. But that's classic misdirection: If the fierce urgency of health-care reform is to radically reduce costs that are producing budget-destroying deficits, revenue neutrality (by definition) leaves us on precisely the same path to insolvency that Obama himself declares unsustainable.

    The Democratic proposals are worse still. Because they do increase costs, revenue neutrality means countervailing tax increases. It's not just that it is crazily anti-stimulatory to saddle a deeply depressed economy with an income tax surcharge that falls squarely on small business and the investor class. It's that health-care reform ends up diverting for its own purposes a source of revenue that might otherwise be used to close the yawning structural budget deficit that is such a threat to the economy and to the dollar.

    http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn...d=opinionsbox1
    Originally Posted by champion110
    I am less angry this morning and ready to get back up on the horse. That girl was a freak last night.

    Originally Posted by champion110
    In fact, I finally had to tell her to stop over the last weekend, because I was worn out and needed a break.

  6. #36
    Champ DogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond repute DogtorEvil's Avatar
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    Re: More on the coming Health Care Shortage...

    How Obama Stumbled on Health Care

    http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000...185061360.html

    Here’s the dirty secret behind Washington’s health-care “fight”: Democrats won everything in last year’s election.

    You wouldn’t know it from the way President Barack Obama is blaming the GOP for his flagging health agenda. “There are those [read the GOP] who are advocating delay just as a desperation move to try to kill it,” complained White House budget director Peter Orszag. Republicans are working to “block health-care reform,” groused the president. “Republicans should immediately put an end to their political games,” demanded Democratic Rep. Chris van Hollen.

    Indeed. The party of the left owns the White House, a filibuster-proof Senate, and a 70-seat House majority. As one House Republican aide quipped: “We could have every GOP congressman and their parents vote against a Democratic bill, and still not stop it.” All Democrats have to do is agree on something.

    That they can’t is testimony to Team Obama’s mismanagement of its first big legislative project. The president is a skilled politician and orator, but the real test of a new administration is whether it can shepherd a high-stakes bill through Congress. In retrospect, the mistakes are growing clear.

    • Living in the short term: The administration thought it was clever back in February, using its $787 billion “stimulus” as an excuse to pass all manner of non-stimulating spending. But the bill sent deficits soaring, forcing those numbers to the center of today’s health debate and unnerving Democratic deficit hawks. Mr. Obama’s demand that a bill be deficit-neutral enthused House liberals to propose crushing tax hikes that further alienated conservative Democrats.

    Mr. Obama boxed himself in on taxes back in his campaign. Senate Finance Chairman Max Baucus and counterpart Chuck Grassley were merrily on their way to a bipartisan deal based on taxing existing health benefits. Yet having slammed John McCain for that idea, the White House vetoed the compromise, derailing an agreement. “The President is not helping us,” bluntly stated Mr. Baucus. “He does not want [that tax]. That’s making it difficult.”

    • Unleashing Congress: Not wanting to repeat Hillary Clinton’s mistaken attempt to micromanage Congress, the administration took the equally dangerous path of no management at all. Left to wild impulses, Nancy Pelosi, Henry Waxman and Ted Kennedy took the most radical of Mr. Obama’s proposals (a public option entitlement) as a starting point, and ran left with new mandates, income tax surcharges, and business penalties. The House bill stirred a Blue Dog rebellion and mired the bill in committee. Mrs. Pelosi failed to include enticements for susceptible Republicans, leaving her hard-pressed to poach GOP votes.

    The White House’s decision to let Mrs. Pelosi charge ahead with her climate bill has also been a disaster. To get that unpopular energy tax through, Mrs. Pelosi had to strip conservative Democrats of their committee rights and then arm-twist them into votes. Their egos and poll ratings bruised, this crew is balking at taking a second one for the team. “If you’re a member who voted for cap and trade and had a bad experience back home, you’re probably not looking forward to a bad vote on a health-care bill that’s not going to go anywhere in the Senate,” says Pennsylvania Blue Dog Jason Altmire.

    • The perils of spin: Selling a huge expansion of government health care in the middle of a recession was never going to be easy. The Obama team hit on the argument that by adding to the government rolls, it would in fact save money and boost the economy.

    Bizarre as this claim was, it became the administration’s prime rationale for “reform.” Until last week, when Congressional Budget Office director Douglas Elmendorf blew it up, noting that the existing House and Senate bills would “significantly expand” federal costs. This gave Democratic senators such as North Dakota’s Kent Conrad an excuse to back away from existing bills, and place new emphasis on a highly uncertain Baucus compromise.

    • False deadlines: Mr. Obama is right to worry this project is a race against time and falling poll numbers. But the administration’s unwavering demand for bills before recess led to the gridlock it hoped to avoid. The deadline inspired the House leadership to rush out a bill without consensus, further antagonizing the Blue Dogs. In the Senate, the pressure on Mr. Baucus to produce has very nearly pushed away Mr. Grassley, who Democrats need for cover.

    A unified Republican message helped raise public alarm. But if they were the problem, Mr. Obama’s campaign arm, Organizing for America, wouldn’t be running TV ads that target his own Democrats. This debate has a stretch to go, and we’re about to see if the administration is nimble enough to adapt its strategy. Some Democrats are even hinting the White House needs to start over. At this point, that might not be bad advice.
    Originally Posted by champion110
    I am less angry this morning and ready to get back up on the horse. That girl was a freak last night.

    Originally Posted by champion110
    In fact, I finally had to tell her to stop over the last weekend, because I was worn out and needed a break.

  7. #37
    Champ personofbluecolor is a splendid one to beholdpersonofbluecolor is a splendid one to beholdpersonofbluecolor is a splendid one to beholdpersonofbluecolor is a splendid one to beholdpersonofbluecolor is a splendid one to beholdpersonofbluecolor is a splendid one to beholdpersonofbluecolor is a splendid one to beholdpersonofbluecolor is a splendid one to beholdpersonofbluecolor is a splendid one to beholdpersonofbluecolor is a splendid one to beholdpersonofbluecolor is a splendid one to behold
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    Re: More on the coming Health Care Shortage...

    Key Chairman Threatens to Bypass Committee on Health Care Bill

    A key House committee chairman on Friday threatened to bypass moderate Democrats who are holding up the health care reform bill and bring the package straight to the floor, in the latest showdown on health care that is dividing Congress and Democratic party ranks.

  8. #38
    Champ TYLERTECHSAS has a reputation beyond reputeTYLERTECHSAS has a reputation beyond reputeTYLERTECHSAS has a reputation beyond reputeTYLERTECHSAS has a reputation beyond reputeTYLERTECHSAS has a reputation beyond reputeTYLERTECHSAS has a reputation beyond reputeTYLERTECHSAS has a reputation beyond reputeTYLERTECHSAS has a reputation beyond reputeTYLERTECHSAS has a reputation beyond reputeTYLERTECHSAS has a reputation beyond reputeTYLERTECHSAS has a reputation beyond repute
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    Re: More on the coming Health Care Shortage...

    Quote Originally Posted by personofbluecolor View Post
    Key Chairman Threatens to Bypass Committee on Health Care Bill

    A key House committee chairman on Friday threatened to bypass moderate Democrats who are holding up the health care reform bill and bring the package straight to the floor, in the latest showdown on health care that is dividing Congress and Democratic party ranks.
    Don't you just love those 2 losers.


    Powerful Rep. Henry Waxman and House Speaker Nancy Pelosi threaten conservative 'Blue Dog' Dems over vote on health care bill.

  9. #39
    Champ DogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond reputeDogtorEvil has a reputation beyond repute DogtorEvil's Avatar
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    Re: More on the coming Health Care Shortage...

    from Fortune:

    5 freedoms you'd lose in health care reform
    If you read the fine print in the Congressional plans, you'll find that a lot of cherished aspects of the current system would disappear.

    1. Freedom to choose what's in your plan
    2. Freedom to be rewarded for healthy living, or pay your real costs
    3. Freedom to choose high-deductible coverage
    4. Freedom to keep your existing plan
    5. Freedom to choose your doctors

    http://money.cnn.com/2009/07/24/news...ion=2009072410
    Originally Posted by champion110
    I am less angry this morning and ready to get back up on the horse. That girl was a freak last night.

    Originally Posted by champion110
    In fact, I finally had to tell her to stop over the last weekend, because I was worn out and needed a break.

  10. #40
    Champ glm47 has a reputation beyond reputeglm47 has a reputation beyond reputeglm47 has a reputation beyond reputeglm47 has a reputation beyond reputeglm47 has a reputation beyond reputeglm47 has a reputation beyond reputeglm47 has a reputation beyond reputeglm47 has a reputation beyond reputeglm47 has a reputation beyond reputeglm47 has a reputation beyond reputeglm47 has a reputation beyond repute
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    Re: More on the coming Health Care Shortage...

    Quote Originally Posted by DogtorEvil View Post
    from Fortune:

    5 freedoms you'd lose in health care reform
    If you read the fine print in the Congressional plans, you'll find that a lot of cherished aspects of the current system would disappear.

    1. Freedom to choose what's in your plan
    2. Freedom to be rewarded for healthy living, or pay your real costs
    3. Freedom to choose high-deductible coverage
    4. Freedom to keep your existing plan
    5. Freedom to choose your doctors

    http://money.cnn.com/2009/07/24/news...ion=2009072410

    Exactly, gov't control is much scarier to me than the cost. That seems to be lost in a lot of the conversations surrounding these proposals.

  11. #41
    Champ saltydawg Ultimate jerk and not worth your timesaltydawg Ultimate jerk and not worth your timesaltydawg Ultimate jerk and not worth your timesaltydawg Ultimate jerk and not worth your timesaltydawg Ultimate jerk and not worth your timesaltydawg Ultimate jerk and not worth your timesaltydawg Ultimate jerk and not worth your timesaltydawg Ultimate jerk and not worth your timesaltydawg Ultimate jerk and not worth your timesaltydawg Ultimate jerk and not worth your timesaltydawg Ultimate jerk and not worth your time saltydawg's Avatar
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    Re: More on the coming Health Care Shortage...

    Quote Originally Posted by nadB View Post
    If you want to create infinite demand for a product or service that has high utility, price it for free and make it an entitlement. ........................duh
    Who says health care is going to be free?

    "All roads lead to Putin" -- Thomas Jefferson



  12. #42
    Champ glm47 has a reputation beyond reputeglm47 has a reputation beyond reputeglm47 has a reputation beyond reputeglm47 has a reputation beyond reputeglm47 has a reputation beyond reputeglm47 has a reputation beyond reputeglm47 has a reputation beyond reputeglm47 has a reputation beyond reputeglm47 has a reputation beyond reputeglm47 has a reputation beyond reputeglm47 has a reputation beyond repute
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    Re: More on the coming Health Care Shortage...

    Quote Originally Posted by saltydawg View Post
    Who says health care is going to be free?

    Missed you for a few days - you must've got your crop harvested.

    Are you exporting to CA?

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