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Thread: Defense of Marriage Act no longer to be defended

  1. #151
    Dawg Adamant Argument Czar Guisslapp has a reputation beyond reputeGuisslapp has a reputation beyond reputeGuisslapp has a reputation beyond reputeGuisslapp has a reputation beyond reputeGuisslapp has a reputation beyond reputeGuisslapp has a reputation beyond reputeGuisslapp has a reputation beyond reputeGuisslapp has a reputation beyond reputeGuisslapp has a reputation beyond reputeGuisslapp has a reputation beyond reputeGuisslapp has a reputation beyond repute Guisslapp's Avatar
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    Re: Defense of Marriage Act no longer to be defended

    Quote Originally Posted by johnnylightnin View Post
    Like I said, it's a struggle (just like it can be for heterosexual couples). It is funny though: I say I know men who struggle with same-sex attraction and they have stable homes...you're response: they're not gay enough.

    got it.
    Well, sh!t, everyone experiences attraction to people outside of their marriage. Some are able to maintain their commitment of monogamy and some are not. I don't see how their struggle is different unless they are not attracted to their partner.

    What I am comparing is homosexual men (as defined in my earlier post - not attracted to the opposite sex) and infertile people.

    If you are not attracted to your partner, I don't see how you can be a good husband. That is what I am saying.
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  2. #152
    2011 Pick 'Em Champion johnnylightnin has a reputation beyond reputejohnnylightnin has a reputation beyond reputejohnnylightnin has a reputation beyond reputejohnnylightnin has a reputation beyond reputejohnnylightnin has a reputation beyond reputejohnnylightnin has a reputation beyond reputejohnnylightnin has a reputation beyond reputejohnnylightnin has a reputation beyond reputejohnnylightnin has a reputation beyond reputejohnnylightnin has a reputation beyond reputejohnnylightnin has a reputation beyond repute johnnylightnin's Avatar
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    Re: Defense of Marriage Act no longer to be defended

    Quote Originally Posted by Guisslapp View Post
    I am surprised he has not weighed in. This is the only subject that he actually knows anything about and he has not posted.
    Time is your friend. Impulse is your enemy. -John Bogle

  3. #153
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    Re: Defense of Marriage Act no longer to be defended

    Quote Originally Posted by johnnylightnin View Post
    The men I'm speaking of would say that they struggle because, apart from their beliefs about the Scripture, they would prefer same-sex partners. They are convinced that they cannot honor God and have same-sex partners, so they work and struggle to have God honoring relationships with their wives (God honoring includes all aspects of the relationship...including the bedroom).
    Gotcha.
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  4. #154
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    Re: Defense of Marriage Act no longer to be defended

    Quote Originally Posted by johnnylightnin View Post
    He gave provisions for dealing with sin too...he's not okay with that.
    What I'm saying is that He said you should not murder. He didn't add the provision, "unless it is for revenge." If He had said that, then I would believe He was OK with murdering if you were taking revenge.

    In divorce situations, he did give some "unless" situations, therefore, I think He is OK with it under those circumstances.

  5. #155
    2011 Pick 'Em Champion johnnylightnin has a reputation beyond reputejohnnylightnin has a reputation beyond reputejohnnylightnin has a reputation beyond reputejohnnylightnin has a reputation beyond reputejohnnylightnin has a reputation beyond reputejohnnylightnin has a reputation beyond reputejohnnylightnin has a reputation beyond reputejohnnylightnin has a reputation beyond reputejohnnylightnin has a reputation beyond reputejohnnylightnin has a reputation beyond reputejohnnylightnin has a reputation beyond repute johnnylightnin's Avatar
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    Re: Defense of Marriage Act no longer to be defended

    Quote Originally Posted by johnnylightnin View Post
    The men I'm speaking of would say that they struggle because, apart from their beliefs about the Scripture, they would prefer same-sex partners. They are convinced that they cannot honor God and have same-sex partners, so they work and struggle to have God honoring relationships with their wives (God honoring includes all aspects of the relationship...including the bedroom).
    Quote Originally Posted by Guisslapp View Post
    Well, sh!t, everyone experiences attraction to people outside of their marriage. Some are able to maintain their commitment of monogamy and some are not. I don't see how their struggle is different unless they are not attracted to their partner.

    What I am comparing is homosexual men (as defined in my earlier post - not attracted to the opposite sex) and infertile people.

    If you are not attracted to your partner, I don't see how you can be a good husband. That is what I am saying.
    I think our posts got in the wrong order.

    My response would be that attraction is something that can be changed or adjusted given the appropriate motivation (for the men I have known, that motivation is their commitment to the Scripture).
    Time is your friend. Impulse is your enemy. -John Bogle

  6. #156
    2011 Pick 'Em Champion johnnylightnin has a reputation beyond reputejohnnylightnin has a reputation beyond reputejohnnylightnin has a reputation beyond reputejohnnylightnin has a reputation beyond reputejohnnylightnin has a reputation beyond reputejohnnylightnin has a reputation beyond reputejohnnylightnin has a reputation beyond reputejohnnylightnin has a reputation beyond reputejohnnylightnin has a reputation beyond reputejohnnylightnin has a reputation beyond reputejohnnylightnin has a reputation beyond repute johnnylightnin's Avatar
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    Re: Defense of Marriage Act no longer to be defended

    Quote Originally Posted by T_Won View Post
    What I'm saying is that He said you should not murder. He didn't add the provision, "unless it is for revenge." If He had said that, then I would believe He was OK with murdering if you were taking revenge.

    In divorce situations, he did give some "unless" situations, therefore, I think He is OK with it under those circumstances.
    I know what you mean. I think a lot of folks agree with you. My contention would be that He never said God hates divorce except in instances of infidelity. It said God hates divorce and then permitted it in the case of infidelity. I think it's possible that he still hates it (even if it may not qualify as sin). There are a few prominent theologians who do not believe the exception clause is original (it has been added later). Some think it is referring to the betrothal period.

    I think the clause is probably original, but I also it's not to be considered a "good" option, but an absolute last resort.
    Time is your friend. Impulse is your enemy. -John Bogle

  7. #157
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    Re: Defense of Marriage Act no longer to be defended

    Quote Originally Posted by LookingForResults View Post
    If that's the way it sounds to you then your hearing's lousy. The public promotion of homosexuality to school children is not a personal freedom. Adoption of children by homosexual couples should not be a personal freedom. A personal freedom should not confer the freedom to promote a perverse lifestyle to children.

    That is just part of the baggage that comes with State sanctioning of what you define as "personal freedom." If that's what some of you like, I hope for this country that you always remain "some" and not "most."
    Yeah we can't get on the slippery slope of recognizing gays as people. Too much is at stake.

  8. #158
    Champ T_Won has a reputation beyond reputeT_Won has a reputation beyond reputeT_Won has a reputation beyond reputeT_Won has a reputation beyond reputeT_Won has a reputation beyond reputeT_Won has a reputation beyond reputeT_Won has a reputation beyond reputeT_Won has a reputation beyond reputeT_Won has a reputation beyond reputeT_Won has a reputation beyond reputeT_Won has a reputation beyond repute
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    Re: Defense of Marriage Act no longer to be defended

    Quote Originally Posted by johnnylightnin View Post
    I know what you mean. I think a lot of folks agree with you. My contention would be that He never said God hates divorce except in instances of infidelity. It said God hates divorce and then permitted it in the case of infidelity. I think it's possible that he still hates it (even if it may not qualify as sin). There are a few prominent theologians who do not believe the exception clause is original (it has been added later). Some think it is referring to the betrothal period.

    I think the clause is probably original, but I also it's not to be considered a "good" option, but an absolute last resort.
    That's deep. I think our marriages have something to do with Jesus' relationship to the church, but I haven't thought about it enough. I know we are to love our wives as Christ loved the church, which to me, means "willing to give our life for her." It's a sacrifice... a "carrying of your cross daily." But are there people in the church who Jesus may want to divorce? People have been unfaithful maybe? I don't know.

  9. #159
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    Re: Defense of Marriage Act no longer to be defended

    Quote Originally Posted by LookingForResults View Post
    What difference does it make? It's one thing to recognize that homosexuality exits; that's obvious. It's quite another to promote it as "healthy." If you believe that it is and wish to have tax dollars dedicated to its promotion, we have views so different that no further discussion is necessary.
    I should agree that no tax dollars be spent on any gayness.

  10. #160
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    Re: Defense of Marriage Act no longer to be defended

    Quote Originally Posted by Guisslapp View Post
    Asexual marriages are not healthy.
    How would you know?

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