Conference re-alignment has jumped the shark

[DawgGoneMad]

1. Notre Dame will NEVER join the Big 12 - this is a Big 12-initiated leak. Notre Dame has ZERO desire to play football games week-in and week-out in Oklahoma, Iowa, and Texas. Sure they'll "drop by and listen" -- don't they just love being courted by everyone but honestly, the Big 12 does nothing for them. Their fan base is East Coast. Their student athletes are east coast. It's essentially an east coast institution and with high academic standards -- and they won't be in the same conference with Iowa State.

2. Florida State and Clemson are serious about the Big 12. They're football-first schools in a non-football first conference and can clearly form an eastern division with WVU. It's really not that bold of a move -- they're both in need of money and the Big 12 could just be that shot in the arm. Plus, they're sick of Tobacco Road running the show and pride themselves on FOOTBALL, FOOTBALL, FOOTBALL.

3. Boise. Here's the big question I always ask about Boise.... what happens when their coach leaves or retires and Boise has a few 6-5 seasons. They're not Nebraska or Michigan or Tennessee or Florida State or Penn State. It's Boise. Once their football goes bust, and it will - they can't maintain it forever (no one can) - then what do they bring to the table? They're a very short-term solution and guaranteed to go bust. Then you're stuck with a dead-weight in Boise of all places. They're the "hot" product everyone has to have but in another 5-10 years you'll be wondering why you needed it.

[HogDawg]

2. Florida State and Clemson are serious about the Big 12. They're football-first schools in a non-football first conference and can clearly form an eastern division with WVU. It's really not that bold of a move -- they're both in need of money and the Big 12 could just be that shot in the arm. Plus, they're sick of Tobacco Road running the show and pride themselves on FOOTBALL, FOOTBALL, FOOTBALL.

Everything you just wrote about Clemson and Florida State is openly refuted by Texas AD Deloss Dodds in today's Dallas Morning News. I can only surmise that you didn't read the article in the post right before yours!

Expansion. Dodds dismissed reports that Florida State and Clemson might be expansion candidates for the Big 12, based on dissatisfaction with the new ACC television contract.

“I don’t think there’s been any contact with Florida State and Clemson either way,” said Dodds, adding that Big 12 continues to debate expansion or staying at 10. “The Florida State-Clemson thing has no basis at all.”

Florida State athletic director Randy disputed growing reports that sprang from message boards and websites.
“We’re in the ACC. We’re committed to the ACC,” Spetman told the Orlando Sentinel.

[hookdown]

It's essentially an east coast institution and with high academic standards -- and they won't be in the same conference with Iowa State.

Ummm, ISU is highly regarded academically.

"Founded in 1858 and coeducational from its start, ISU is classified as a Research University with very high research activity (RU/VH) by the Carnegie Foundation for the Advancement of Teaching.^[4] The university is a group member of the prestigious American Association of Universities, Universities Research Association...."


They are members of AAU, ND is not.

[JuBru]

Everything you just wrote about Clemson and Florida State is openly refuted by Texas AD Deloss Dodds in today's Dallas Morning News. I can only surmise that you didn't read the article in the post right before yours!

Article says B12 not interested in FSU/Clemson. DGM says FSU/Clemson are interested in B12. Two different statements.

Look at FSU/Clemson and B12 as being Tech and CUSA 2004. Tech wants CUSA, but CUSA didn't want Tech. Same here.

[TYLERTECHSAS]

FSU BOARD ‘UNANIMOUSLY IN FAVOR OF SEEING WHAT BIG 12 MIGHT OFFER'
Last Updated 4:09 PM, May 12, 2012 EDT

[DawgGoneMad]

Using wikipedia to defend Iowa State's academic standing against Notre Dame is laughable. AS IS the idea that they would jump to the Big 12! Not so sure you understand Notre Dame on a cultural level. It's a Catholic university that invited a pro-choice president to speak at their commencement. They're east coast. They're Catholic. They're Irish. And they need to maintain a connection to the east coast. And they have no cultural connection to Texas, Kansas or Okie. This rumor isn't even worth discussing further - it's some Big 12 pipe dream that ended up with WVU and maybe Louisville. So wouldn't FSU and Clemson be nice! Almost Notre Dame.... OH, and Florida could recruit in Texas and vice versa. Sounds like a great plan to me!

[Bigdog13]

DGM,

What will Boise do when their coach leaves? Probably the same thing they did after the last 3 coaches left for high paying AQ gigs.

[HogDawg]

Article says B12 not interested in FSU/Clemson. DGM says FSU/Clemson are interested in B12. Two different statements.

No, the article also clearly quotes the Florida State AD saying they are committed to the ACC and that he disputes the Big XII rumors too. It's coming from BOTH sides.





HD

[The Historian]

http://www.kansascity.com/2012/05/12...-comments.html

More on the FSU Trustee comments from the Kansas City Star:

In an interview that was posted Saturday on the Rivals.com site that covers Florida State sports, Warchant.com, Haggard blasted the ACC. He called the conference’s new television-rights contract with ESPN, which was announced on Wednesday, a raw deal for Florida State.

Later Saturday, Seminoles football coach Jimbo Fisher told the Sentinel that there had been no official talks with the Big 12 but that if leaving the ACC “is what’s best for Florida State, then that's what we need to do.”

At issue: The ACC surrendered its schools’ third-tier rights for football games — ESPN will control those — but allowed the schools to maintain those rights for basketball.
Schools that hold third-tier rights can negotiate their own deals for broadcasts and keep that income, which in the ACC’s case favors schools with the strongest basketball brands — North Carolina and Duke.

“It’s mind-boggling and shocking,” Haggard told Warchant.com. “It continue the perception that the ACC favors the North Carolina schools.”

[hookdown]

Using wikipedia to defend Iowa State's academic standing against Notre Dame is laughable.

OK, I will use these sources:

American Association of Universities


http://www.aau.edu/about/default.aspx?id=5476


Look, there is ISU. Not seeing ND anywhere on the list.


Universities Research Association


http://www.ura-hq.org/universities/index.html


Yes, I see ISU AND ND.


US News national rankings

http://colleges.usnews.rankingsandre...rsities/spp+50


ISU # 97 ND # 19


What I was trying to get across was that ISU is a highly ranked school in academics. To say that ND would not want to be associated with them because of academics is not true. I have no idea if ND would consider going to the Big 12 or not. I suspect they would not and are much more likely to go to the ACC, if they go anywhere. Your argument would have more credence if you had used OSU or Texas Tech instead. Both are Tier 3 schools.

[JuBru]

No, the article also clearly quotes the Florida State AD saying they are committed to the ACC and that he disputes the Big XII rumors too. It's coming from BOTH sides.
HD

And Tech is committed to the WAC. Pitt and Syracuse are committed to the Big East. Nebraska, Colorado, Texas A&M, and Missouri are committed to the Big XVII.

Being "committed" to something does not mean you are not interested in or not in pursuit of something else. I guess you skipped over the article TT posted about the FSU board? Seems FSU is interested in looking at the B12 or something else besides the ACC.

And the AD didn't "dispute" anything. Just read the company line of commitment.

[The Historian]

It's easy to see why FSU officials are almost certainly, behind closed doors, very interested in the Big 12. The ACC deal will pay Florida State $16 million per year for first, second, and third-tier rights for football. The $17 million figure quoted doesn't take into consideration the fact the ACC office intends to keep a share for itself. Contrast that with the Big 12's new deal at $20 million per school for only first and second tier rights.

ESPN controls the first tier rights for both leagues and would not want to up the Big 12's first-tier deal as an incentive for an FSU or Clemson to bolt the ACC, which it completely controls. But Fox, which controls second-tier rights in the Big 12, would likely throw money at the idea.

For argument's sake, let's say they additional dollars would mean a 12-school Big 12 payout of $22 million per school for first and second tier rights. Again, for argument's sake, let's say FSU then creates a network in the state of Florida that provides it with third-tier dollars of between $3 million and $5 million per year.

Just using those number, which are conservative, FSU would be generating an additional $9 million to $11 million in the Big 12 over and above what they would be getting in the ACC. And it might be a lot more. They would be foolish not to push for that.

[GrassyNoleHitman]

It's easy to see why FSU officials are almost certainly, behind closed doors, very interested in the Big 12. The ACC deal will pay Florida State $16 million per year for first, second, and third-tier rights for football. The $17 million figure quoted doesn't take into consideration the fact the ACC office intends to keep a share for itself. Contrast that with the Big 12's new deal at $20 million per school for only first and second tier rights.

ESPN controls the first tier rights for both leagues and would not want to up the Big 12's first-tier deal as an incentive for an FSU or Clemson to bolt the ACC, which it completely controls. But Fox, which controls second-tier rights in the Big 12, would likely throw money at the idea.

For argument's sake, let's say they additional dollars would mean a 12-school Big 12 payout of $22 million per school for first and second tier rights. Again, for argument's sake, let's say FSU then creates a network in the state of Florida that provides it with third-tier dollars of between $3 million and $5 million per year.

Just using those number, which are conservative, FSU would be generating an additional $9 million to $11 million in the Big 12 over and above what they would be getting in the ACC. And it might be a lot more. They would be foolish not to push for that.

what can i say. when you are right, you are right.

since the odds of me living near any FSU road games any time soon is remote, i prefer them to be in a better conference and get better games on TV. the Big 12 would provide the better product. personally i would hope that Miami comes with us rather than Clempsun, but i can understand why UM may want to stay. it would just mean the end of either the UF or UM rivalries if we can't get Miami to come along.

[GrassyNoleHitman]

Article says B12 not interested in FSU/Clemson. DGM says FSU/Clemson are interested in B12. Two different statements.

Look at FSU/Clemson and B12 as being Tech and CUSA 2004. Tech wants CUSA, but CUSA didn't want Tech. Same here.

looks like the Big 12 is interested in FSU...

https://twitter.com/#!/DanWetzel/sta...02073827389440
Big 12 source on whether league would be interested in Florida State. "I can't imagine how we wouldn't be interested in Florida State."

[Lotsudo]

OK, I will use these sources:

American Association of Universities


http://www.aau.edu/about/default.aspx?id=5476


Look, there is ISU. Not seeing ND anywhere on the list.


Universities Research Association


http://www.ura-hq.org/universities/index.html


Yes, I see ISU AND ND.


US News national rankings

http://colleges.usnews.rankingsandre...rsities/spp+50


ISU # 97 ND # 19


What I was trying to get across was that ISU is a highly ranked school in academics. To say that ND would not want to be associated with them because of academics is not true. I have no idea if ND would consider going to the Big 12 or not. I suspect they would not and are much more likely to go to the ACC, if they go anywhere. Your argument would have more credence if you had used OSU or Texas Tech instead. Both are Tier 3 schools.

Your point is agood one...however, the AAU is a self serving organization that is elitist in every aspect of what their charter is all about! “A membership committee of AAU presidents and chancellors periodically reviews universities for AAU membership; institutions recommended for membership must be approved by a three-fourths vote of the membership.” Puleeeeeze! Really because it is considered an “exclusive club?” Yes the 34 public and 25 private Colleges and Universities that are members are highly regarded schools…but there are a lot of great institutions that are not members because of philosophical diffences in regards to politics and religion, emphasis to large (and I mean LARGE) research universities, no medical/law school, or the fact that they change the rules for acceptance mid-stream to suit their agenda! I don’t buy it!!!!!!