Covid - 19

[Guisslapp]

Sweden to reach herd immunity very soon.

Its neighbors closed borders, schools, bars and businesses as the coronavirus pandemic swept through Europe, but Sweden went against the grain by keeping public life as unrestricted as possible.
The strategy — aimed at allowing some exposure to the virus in order to build immunity among the general population while protecting high-risk groups like the elderly — has been controversial. Some health experts liken it to playing Russian roulette with public health.


But now, the country’s chief epidemiologist said the strategy appears to be working and that “herd immunity” could be reached in the capital Stockholm in a matter of weeks


https://www.cnbc.com/2020/04/22/no-l...-in-weeks.html

We aren’t even sure herd immunity is possible for coronavirus if people can be reinfected.

Herd immunity is based on infectivity and this disease is more infective than originally thought. Gottlieb explained it this way: for an infectious disease that is spread from every 1 person to 2 people, you need 50% of the population to have it for herd immunity, for 1:3, you need 66%, etc. COVID is thought to be at least 1:3, so you will likely need over 70 percent to get it assuming people can’t be reinfected.

As the CNBC article mentions, Sweden has been unsuccessful at isolating their at risk population. We have had similar problems in the US, because you can’t really achieve that. The more people that get this disease, the more likely it finds its way into the at-risk population. We continue to see this trend in nursing homes everyone, even some hitting very close to home.

[Guisslapp]

Oh, there's a difference. If you took a finger on each hand and put it into each ear, you'd be pointing with both fingers at the source of your grief. That's quite different than this virus.

I knew you'd go there because of your narcissism, because I knew you'd equate your inability to accept that anything exists outside of yourself with the physical pain and death of others.

You sound confused again. Feeling okay?

[Guisslapp]

Remdesivir apparently flopped in its China trial.

“We regret that the WHO prematurely posted information regarding the study, which has since been removed. The investigators in this study did not provide permission for publication of results,” a Gilead spokesperson said in a statement to CNBC.

“Furthermore, we believe the post included inappropriate characterizations of the study. Importantly, because this study was terminated early due to low enrollment, it was underpowered to enable statistically meaningful conclusions,” according to Gilead. “As such, the study results are inconclusive, though trends in the data suggest a potential benefit for remdesivir, particularly among patients treated early in disease.”

In any event, the US clinical trial data for Remdesivir should become available soon.

[detltu]

“We regret that the WHO prematurely posted information regarding the study, which has since been removed. The investigators in this study did not provide permission for publication of results,” a Gilead spokesperson said in a statement to CNBC.

“Furthermore, we believe the post included inappropriate characterizations of the study. Importantly, because this study was terminated early due to low enrollment, it was underpowered to enable statistically meaningful conclusions,” according to Gilead. “As such, the study results are inconclusive, though trends in the data suggest a potential benefit for remdesivir, particularly among patients treated early in disease.”

In any event, the US clinical trial data for Remdesivir should become available soon.

Still holding out hope this shows more promise.

[dawg80]

I guess you don’t have a real answer or logical explanation?

You're just yanking my chain now. You're an anti-American azz, but you're not this stupid.

[dawg80]

“We regret that the WHO prematurely posted information regarding the study, which has since been removed. The investigators in this study did not provide permission for publication of results,” a Gilead spokesperson said in a statement to CNBC.

“Furthermore, we believe the post included inappropriate characterizations of the study. Importantly, because this study was terminated early due to low enrollment, it was underpowered to enable statistically meaningful conclusions,” according to Gilead. “As such, the study results are inconclusive, though trends in the data suggest a potential benefit for remdesivir, particularly among patients treated early in disease.”

In any event, the US clinical trial data for Remdesivir should become available soon.

Nah! ain't buying it. The WHO never makes mistakes. They are perfect.

And since Gilead is involved it's all bullshit! Follow the $$$$$$$$$$$$.

[Guisslapp]

Nah! ain't buying it. The WHO never makes mistakes. They are perfect.

And since Gilead is involved it's all bullshit! Follow the $$$$$$$$$$$$.

More conspiracy theory innuendo, but not facts, hunh?

[FriscoDog]

Most overused word of 2020 "Experts"...

[FriscoDog]

My daughter is an ICU nurse at the largest public hospital in DFW. She treats Covid-19 patients every day. I asked her what are they using to treat them, and she said that have been using Cloraquin and Zythromycin (spelling).. and are just starting to use Remdesivir. She said that with Cloraquin and Z combination, she saw very sick patients make miraculous turn arounds in 24 hours. So, I will put my daughter's first hand experience up against a political motivated study any day.

[Guisslapp]

My daughter is an ICU nurse at the largest public hospital in DFW. She treats Covid-19 patients every day. I asked her what are they using to treat them, and she said that have been using Cloraquin and Zythromycin (spelling).. and are just starting to use Remdesivir. She said that with Cloraquin and Z combination, she saw very sick patients make miraculous turn arounds in 24 hours. So, I will put my daughter's first hand experience up against a political motivated study any day.

Anecdotes are just that. The question is would they have recovered just the same without the therapy. That is what you can’t know without a study - and so far the studies suggest that they would.

[PawDawg]

so far the studies suggest that they would.

No "the studies" don't. Only the one or two you focus on do. You had one yesterday that had people dying who were on the vent, but blaming the drugs. News flash, vent patients are the ones who are dying.

[Guisslapp]

No "the studies" don't. Only the one or two you focus on do. You had one yesterday that had people dying who were on the vent, but blaming the drugs. News flash, vent patients are the ones who are dying.

Dying patients are the ones being put on vents.

Check out what the NIH is recommending.

[PawDawg]

Dying patients are the ones being put on vents.

that’s what I said

[dawg80]

A good friend's mother, who is 77 and has some health issues, has C-19 and is hospitalized. They put her on a ventilator and she developed pnuemonia. They took her off the vent. and her conditioned has improved. She is breathing better. Of course, she has to now survive the pnuemonia. My friend is incensed saying they nearly killed her with that "damn ventilator."

A nurse acquaintance told me, "no matter what, you, a loved-one, whoever you know, STAY OFF those ventilators!"

I heard that 88% of those placed on a ventilator, to fight this virus, have died. I HEARD that on TV, not sure who said it, but I think it was that Dr. Birx (spelling?), the woman with the ugly, grandmotherly scarves.

[Guisslapp]

A good friend's mother, who is 77 and has some health issues, has C-19 and is hospitalized. They put her on a ventilator and she developed pnuemonia. They took her off the vent. and her conditioned has improved. She is breathing better. Of course, she has to now survive the pnuemonia. My friend is incensed saying they nearly killed her with that "damn ventilator."

A nurse acquaintance told me, "no matter what, you, a loved-one, whoever you know, STAY OFF those ventilators!"

I heard that 88% of those placed on a ventilator, to fight this virus, have died. I HEARD that on TV, not sure who said it, but I think it was that Dr. Birx (spelling?), the woman with the ugly, grandmotherly scarves.

The 88 percent is the NYC number. Around 80 percent seems to be consistent.

Some docs are advising some patients not to go on the vent because of quality of life factors. At least they can still communicate over FaceTime with their family for longer.

Most docs try to keep the patient on mask oxygen up to the highest limit and even allow the blood oxygen to get below the threshold where you would change someone over (I forget the number- something like 9x% blood oxygen at 7 liters/min). This is anecdotal from a friend that has had family get to the stage where you would normally put someone on a vent and just a day later their body started to catch up with the disease and their blood oxygen levels started to come back. They were sent home with oxygen (but even getting home as someone with COVID is itself a tricky issue).