GMAC Bowl

[Tbone1]

Tech versus South Carolina for instance. Would that not be a much better draw than South Carolina versus Baylor.

Way to stack the odds in your favor there. You penciled in the single worst Big12 team you could find. Has Baylor even been to a bowl in the last 10 years? Seriously.

Look at the last several Big12 teams who have visited the Indy Bowl. They include: Nebraska, Oklahoma State, Texas Tech, Missouri, Iowa State, and even Oklahoma in 2000 or 2001.

Some of those are "name" programs that will draw a crowd.

But I like your line of thinking. Tech should have some sort of side deal with the Indy Bowl...I just don't know how that would work. They already have a contract with the SEC and Big12. I'm pretty sure they are happy with that arrangement.

[HogDawg]

Way to stack the odds in your favor there. You penciled in the single worst Big12 team you could find. Has Baylor even been to a bowl in the last 10 years? Seriously.

No, Baylor hasn't been to a bowl since 1994, when they lost a close one to Washington State in the Alamo Bowl. (They also beat us badly that year, 44-3.)

Actually, Baylor has very good fan support. The Bears averaged 37,080 fans over 7 home games in 2006. That's very good for a program that's gone 32-91 over the past 11 years. (That's an average of less than 3 wins per year). Can you imagine how good Baylor's attendance will be if they ever post back to back winning seasons? They'll easily average 50K.

http://www.wwwncaa.com/stats/footbal...nce/index.html

BTW, when the Big 12 celebrated its 10-year anniversary in 2005, Baylor was 4th in All-Time Big 12 sports titles sponsored by Baylor, behind only Texas, Nebraska and Colorado. They finished ahead of Oklahoma, Texas A&M, OSU, T Tech and everyone else. So while the Bears' struggles in football continue, the fact is they compete very well in all other sports.

HD

[Bigdog13]

Growing up with Teaff as the HC of Baylor I never could have envisioned them sucking this bad for this long. Remember these guys aren't like Vandy or Temple or something. They were never a world beater, but they were a good , solid team for many years.

[Tbone1]

I agree that Baylor fares well in a number of other sports, but the money sports is where they have been a "liability" to the conference.

Women's tennis doesn't turn a profit. Football and, to an extent, basketball can turn enough profit to carry an entire athletic department.

Right now, Baylor is sucking off the teet of the Big12's major programs. They rake in 1/13th of all the Bowl money and 1/13th of the Final 4 money that is brought in by the other members. They also have almost zero TV appeal, yet they pull 1/12th of the TV money for the Conference.

The almighty dollar is at work here, and it wouldn't shock me to see Baylor looking for a new conference to call home within the next 10 years (if those things don't turn around).

[Bigdog13]

I don't know T. I think they are just one good head coach away from being just as good or better than Kansas, Iowa St, Oklahoma St, KSU , Colorado and Missouri. I don't see them ever competing consistently with OU, Nebraska, UT , Tech and A&M but other than that I think with the right coaching hires they could do just fine.

[HogDawg]

I agree that Baylor fares well in a number of other sports, but the money sports is where they have been a "liability" to the conference.

Women's tennis doesn't turn a profit. Football and, to an extent, basketball can turn enough profit to carry an entire athletic department.

Right now, Baylor is sucking off the teet of the Big12's major programs. They rake in 1/13th of all the Bowl money and 1/13th of the Final 4 money that is brought in by the other members. They also have almost zero TV appeal, yet they pull 1/12th of the TV money for the Conference.

The almighty dollar is at work here, and it wouldn't shock me to see Baylor looking for a new conference to call home within the next 10 years (if those things don't turn around).

That post makes no sense, whatsoever.

On one hand you say it's all about "the almightly dollar at work here", then in the same sentence you say you wouldn't be surprised to see Baylor looking for a new conference. Those statements contradict each other. If Baylor is raking in 1/12th of the TV money from the conference (just like the other 11 conference schools) and can still manage to compete nicely in the other Big 12 sports, seems to me Baylor has no problem......especially financial. Why would they change conferences?

Maybe it is only a problem in a Louisiana Tech fans eyes. :icon_wink:

HD

[HogDawg]

I don't know T. I think they are just one good head coach away from being just as good or better than Kansas, Iowa St, Oklahoma St, KSU , Colorado and Missouri. I don't see them ever competing consistently with OU, Nebraska, UT , Tech and A&M but other than that I think with the right coaching hires they could do just fine.

I agree. Last year Baylor beat Kansas, Kansas St and Colorado. And they lost very close games to several others (including A&M). Baylor is very competitive in the Big 12 (or at least they were in 2006).

Baylor just needs to spend some of that Big 12 money on obtaining a real BIG TIME football coach, just like they've done in women's basketball. They have the money. Money is NOT a problem for Baylor.

HD

[Tbone1]

That post makes no sense, whatsoever.

On one hand you say it's all about "the almightly dollar at work here", then in the same sentence you say you wouldn't be surprised to see Baylor looking for a new conference. Those statements contradict each other. If Baylor is raking in 1/12th of the TV money from the conference (just like the other 11 conference schools) and can still manage to compete nicely in the other Big 12 sports, seems to me Baylor has no problem......especially financial. Why would they change conferences?

Involuntarily.

I guess I could have been a little clearer in the way I addressed it.

[Tbone1]

The almighty dollar is at work here, and it wouldn't shock me to see Baylor looking for a new conference to call home within the next 10 years (if those things don't turn around).

The way I wrote it was intended to imply that they would be "out on the streets" and looking for a new conference to call home.

I don't disagree with you that the Baylor program is capable of competing and ripe for a turnaround. But in the last 12 years, they have yet to contribute a single dime to the Big12 offering plate. Zero bowls. Zero NCAA tournament appearances. Maybe an NIT or two.

Meanwhile, they've lived off the table crumbs of the OU's, Texas's, and Nebraska's of the conference. Every other school has made contributions via bowls or Big Dance appearances.

Baylor really needs to turn the corner at some point before they find themselves out on the street.

[Bigdog13]

I see where you are coming from but the only time I ever heard of that happening was with Temple.

Vandy still has a home.

For a long time Rutgers was just like Baylor and they weren't kicked out.

I personally think their Big12 South bretheren like having one team on their schedule that is a little bit easier. I don't think they need to worry. Living in Texas and paying attention to college football I just don't ever hear anything about the other members being disgruntled with Baylor. That being said I agree they need to pick it up. FB and MBB have been embarassments in more ways than one.

[Tbone1]

I heard rumors that Baylor is kept around because of it being a private school.
Something about that being a safehaven for the Conference's record books.

Maybe that's the same deal with Vandy.

I don't understand how that all works, but if it gives them the right to deny access to conference records...then it's probably legit.

[HogDawg]

The way I wrote it was intended to imply that they would be "out on the streets" and looking for a new conference to call home.

I don't disagree with you that the Baylor program is capable of competing and ripe for a turnaround. But in the last 12 years, they have yet to contribute a single dime to the Big12 offering plate. Zero bowls. Zero NCAA tournament appearances. Maybe an NIT or two.

Meanwhile, they've lived off the table crumbs of the OU's, Texas's, and Nebraska's of the conference. Every other school has made contributions via bowls or Big Dance appearances.

Baylor really needs to turn the corner at some point before they find themselves out on the street.

I disagree. The Big 12 doesn't depend on Baylor for Bowl revenues or Big Dance appearances (although I do believe the Baylor basketball program will be dancing again very soon.) The Big 12 has Texas, TA&M, Oklahoma, and Nebraska for that.

Baylor's role in the Big 12 equates to academic legitimacy. In 2005 (the last year I have stats for), Baylor was the only Big 12 program and one of only 6 NCAA institutions nationally to rank in both the Top 10 of the most recent NCAA Graduation Rates Report for overall student athlete graduation success, and the NCAA Directors' Cup Top 25. The other five schools were Stanford, Duke, Virginia, Notre Dame and Penn State. That's pretty good company. Baylor's 2005 graduation rate of 78% for ALL student athletes ranked 10th among all Div 1A institutions. And the Big 12 is glad to have them.

On the athletic front, Baylor joined Tennessee, Michigan St and Texas as the only schools to place a team in two of the four major sports championship venues during the 2004-05 academic school year: a BCS Bowl, the men's final four, the women's Final Four and the college world series.

BTW, Baylor is one of only six Big 12 schools to win an NCAA Championship in a team sport since the league's inception. Baylor has two NCAA championships; one in men's tennis in 2004, and one in women's basketball in 2005.

Here's the point: Make no mistake....almost every school in the Big 12 has a "role" to play....and Baylor's role is clearly to be one of the country's top academic leaders, and the Bears are succeeding at that. The Big 12 doesn't depend on Baylor for bowl revenues. Baylor is not a football factory.....that's OU and UT's role.

HD

[nadB]

....and Baylor's role is clearly to be one of the country's top academic leaders, and the Bears are succeeding at that.....HD

Get Serious.

Nobody thinks Baylor is one or the country's top academic leaders, except mebbe you.

My sister graduated from LA Tech, then went to FL State for her master's degree. She worked for EDS for 10+ years and then went to law school at Baylor, only because it was the only law school in Texas where one could enter at mid-year (at least, is was then).

She told me she thought the classes at Baylor were pretty much like taking crip-courses. And yeah, she finished first in her class at law school at Baylor..................

[HogDawg]

Get Serious.

Nobody thinks Baylor is one or the country's top academic leaders, except mebbe you.

My sister graduated from LA Tech, then went to FL State for her master's degree. She worked for EDS for 10+ years and then went to law school at Baylor, only because it was the only law school in Texas where one could enter at mid-year (at least, is was then).

She told me she thought the classes at Baylor were pretty much like taking crip-courses. And yeah, she finished first in her class at law school at Baylor..................

Oh puleeze. Like I give a crap about your sister.

HD

[nadB]

Oh puleeze. Like I give a crap about your sister.

HD

Oh puleeze. Like I give a crap about your love for baylor ??