Global Warming Cont...

[Dirtydawg]

Ok, here it is. In the early chapters of the Old Testament, where the stories of creation appear, it is emphasized that humans have a responsibility to care for the Earth. (see Genesis 2:15, 2:19, 2:12, 2:9, and 1:27) In fact, further on in the Old Testament there are passages which give detailed instructions regarding care for the land and the environment. (See Leviticus 19:23-25, 25:1-7. Also Deuteronomy 25:4)

As a general overview of Christianity, its twin doctrines of creation and incarnation demonstrate the Lord's interest in and concern for the Earth and the life it contains. Consequently, are we not stewards of his work?

Salty, did you even read those scriptures or did you just google and paste? A couple of them, I saw no correlation at all. They still say nothing about "protecting" the earth. Now don't get me wrong, as arkbob says, I think it's clear that we be good stewards of the earth, but to say that these scriptures direct us to protect it, is a stretch. Actually, the first time it's mentioned in Genesis, we are to "rule" over everything. The next mention in Genesis, I think, one could argue applies to the Garden of Eden specifically and not the whole earth. I don't know what his naming the animals has to do with "protecting" them. The rest of the scriptures say nothing about protecting the earth. Now, if it had said, "don't tear down forests to make fields for your crops or towns. The Lord has provided land in plenty for your needs." That would be a different story. Once again, I don't dispute what arkbob says about being good stewards even though I'm not convinced that these scriptures even direct us to do that. I just get perterbed when a person who doesn't give the Bible any credence tries to create meanings that aren't there to use it to support his argument while not really knowing what the Bible says. Here are the verses so you can actually read them. Minus the ones that made no sense to the argument.

Genesis 1:28

28 God blessed them and said to them, "Be fruitful and increase in number; fill the earth and subdue it. Rule over the fish of the sea and the birds of the air and over every living creature that moves on the ground."

Genesis 2:15, 19

15 The LORD God took the man and put him in the Garden of Eden to work it and take care of it.

19 Now the LORD God had formed out of the ground all the beasts of the field and all the birds of the air. He brought them to the man to see what he would name them; and whatever the man called each living creature, that was its name.

Leviticus 19:23-25

23 " 'When you enter the land and plant any kind of fruit tree, regard its fruit as forbidden. [b] For three years you are to consider it forbidden [c] ; it must not be eaten. 24 In the fourth year all its fruit will be holy, an offering of praise to the LORD. 25 But in the fifth year you may eat its fruit. In this way your harvest will be increased. I am the LORD your God.

Leviticus 25:1-7

1 The LORD said to Moses on Mount Sinai, 2 "Speak to the Israelites and say to them: 'When you enter the land I am going to give you, the land itself must observe a sabbath to the LORD. 3 For six years sow your fields, and for six years prune your vineyards and gather their crops. 4 But in the seventh year the land is to have a sabbath of rest, a sabbath to the LORD. Do not sow your fields or prune your vineyards. 5 Do not reap what grows of itself or harvest the grapes of your untended vines. The land is to have a year of rest. 6 Whatever the land yields during the sabbath year will be food for you—for yourself, your manservant and maidservant, and the hired worker and temporary resident who live among you, 7 as well as for your livestock and the wild animals in your land. Whatever the land produces may be eaten.

Deuteronomy 25:4

4 Do not muzzle an ox while it is treading out the grain.

[saltydawg]

what the article says is that warming causes more wind shear, which makes it harder for hurricanes to form and strengthen. so, yes, this would decrease the likelihood of landfall in the u.s., but only because it decreases the likelihood of sustained major storms. which is completely contrary to the tune you were singing in 2006.

as for the bible question, my point is that we have to rely on science, not the bible, to determine what we should do regarding global warming. since the science supporting global warming is not very convincing, there is no biblical responsibility to reduce co2 emissions.

What we have here is a case of you reading more into the article than was presented. The article stated:

"In the study, researchers from the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration and the University of Miami in Florida link warming oceans to increased vertical wind shear in the Atlantic Ocean *NEAR* the United States."

Note: the article didn't say that there would be fewer hurricanes, did it? Read the title of the article and that should give you a hint..

As for strength of the science supporting global warming, you are welcome to your opinion. The vast majority of climate scientists think otherwise.

[saltydawg]

Salty, did you even read those scriptures or did you just google and paste? A couple of them, I saw no correlation at all. They still say nothing about "protecting" the earth. Now don't get me wrong, as arkbob says, I think it's clear that we be good stewards of the earth, but to say that these scriptures direct us to protect it, is a stretch. Actually, the first time it's mentioned in Genesis, we are to "rule" over everything. The next mention in Genesis, I think, one could argue applies to the Garden of Eden specifically and not the whole earth. I don't know what his naming the animals has to do with "protecting" them. The rest of the scriptures say nothing about protecting the earth. Now, if it had said, "don't tear down forests to make fields for your crops or towns. The Lord has provided land in plenty for your needs." That would be a different story. Once again, I don't dispute what arkbob says about being good stewards even though I'm not convinced that these scriptures even direct us to do that. I just get perterbed when a person who doesn't give the Bible any credence tries to create meanings that aren't there to use it to support his argument while not really knowing what the Bible says. Here are the verses so you can actually read them. Minus the ones that made no sense to the argument.

Genesis 1:28

28 God blessed them and said to them, "Be fruitful and increase in number; fill the earth and subdue it. Rule over the fish of the sea and the birds of the air and over every living creature that moves on the ground."

Genesis 2:15, 19

15 The LORD God took the man and put him in the Garden of Eden to work it and take care of it.

19 Now the LORD God had formed out of the ground all the beasts of the field and all the birds of the air. He brought them to the man to see what he would name them; and whatever the man called each living creature, that was its name.

Leviticus 19:23-25

23 " 'When you enter the land and plant any kind of fruit tree, regard its fruit as forbidden. [b] For three years you are to consider it forbidden [c] ; it must not be eaten. 24 In the fourth year all its fruit will be holy, an offering of praise to the LORD. 25 But in the fifth year you may eat its fruit. In this way your harvest will be increased. I am the LORD your God.

Leviticus 25:1-7

1 The LORD said to Moses on Mount Sinai, 2 "Speak to the Israelites and say to them: 'When you enter the land I am going to give you, the land itself must observe a sabbath to the LORD. 3 For six years sow your fields, and for six years prune your vineyards and gather their crops. 4 But in the seventh year the land is to have a sabbath of rest, a sabbath to the LORD. Do not sow your fields or prune your vineyards. 5 Do not reap what grows of itself or harvest the grapes of your untended vines. The land is to have a year of rest. 6 Whatever the land yields during the sabbath year will be food for you—for yourself, your manservant and maidservant, and the hired worker and temporary resident who live among you, 7 as well as for your livestock and the wild animals in your land. Whatever the land produces may be eaten.

Deuteronomy 25:4

4 Do not muzzle an ox while it is treading out the grain.

Yes, we are stewards of the Garden (Earth). We are God's gardeners and we are charged with taking care of His Garden. To me, that means protecting it from harm and making it better. He is very, very interested in what we are doing with His Garden because He specifically mentions how to be a gardener in the Bible.

Of course, one has to apply the Scriptures to modern times.

[Dirtydawg]

Yes, we are stewards of the Garden (Earth). We are God's gardeners and we are charged with taking care of His Garden. To me, that means protecting it from harm and making it better. He is very, very interested in what we are doing with His Garden because He specifically mentions how to be a gardener in the Bible.

Of course, one has to apply the Scriptures to modern times.

You do realize that the Garden of Eden is not Earth. You do realize that, don't you? It appears as though you are doing what you accused arkbob of doing-reading too much into something.

[saltydawg]

You do realize that the Garden of Eden is not Earth. You do realize that, don't you? It appears as though you are doing what you accused arkbob of doing-reading too much into something.

DD, that is news to me. Of course the Garden of Eden is the planet Earth. Isn't it somewhere in Arkansas?

[johnnylightnin]

Of course the Garden of Eden is the planet Earth.

It is on earth, but it is not analogous with the entire Earth.

[saltydawg]

It is on earth, but it is not analogous with the entire Earth.

Says who?

[johnnylightnin]

Says who?

The Bible

Unless of course you think that when God cast Adam and Eve out of the Garden, they were cast onto a new planet. In which case, what planet are we on?

[saltydawg]

The Bible

Unless of course you think that when God cast Adam and Eve out of the Garden, they were cast onto a new planet. In which case, what planet are we on?

Ah, so you think that the Garden of Eden is a particular place on Earth? Another way of looking at the Scriptures is that the entire planet was the Garden of Eden and God cast Adam and Eve *out of it* by giving them Knowledge, ie, self-awareness.. Anyway, that's how I look at it. Physically, we are all still in the Garden of Eden.

[johnnylightnin]

Ah, so you think that the Garden of Eden is a particular place on Earth? Another way of looking at the Scriptures is that the entire planet was the Garden of Eden and God cast Adam and Eve *out of it* by giving them Knowledge, ie, self-awareness.. Anyway, that's how I look at it.

I haven't studied Genesis in an academic sense, but this is the first I've ever heard that proposition. I'll see if I can find some folks who take it like that.

[Dirtydawg]

Ah, so you think that the Garden of Eden is a particular place on Earth? Another way of looking at the Scriptures is that the entire planet was the Garden of Eden and God cast Adam and Eve *out of it* by giving them Knowledge, ie, self-awareness.. Anyway, that's how I look at it. Physically, we are all still in the Garden of Eden.

Genesis 2:8 describes it as a particular place. Even if you assume that Eden was what God called the planet Earth, the Garden was a particular place in Eden.

Genesis 2:8
8 Now the LORD God had planted a garden in the east, in Eden; and there he put the man he had formed.

It doesn't say the Eden was a garden. It says that a garden was planted in Eden the terminology which gives further credence that Eden, itself, was a place on Earth otherwise he would have said a garden was planted on Eden.

[arkansasbob]

What we have here is a case of you reading more into the article than was presented. The article stated:

"In the study, researchers from the National Oceanic and Atmospheric Administration and the University of Miami in Florida link warming oceans to increased vertical wind shear in the Atlantic Ocean *NEAR* the United States."

Note: the article didn't say that there would be fewer hurricanes, did it? Read the title of the article and that should give you a hint..

As for strength of the science supporting global warming, you are welcome to your opinion. The vast majority of climate scientists think otherwise.

what we have here is a case of you taking things at face value without considering the full implication.

you are correct that the study is very specific to the warmer waters near the u.s. that doesn't change the fact that it contradicts your categorical statement that higher near surface water temperatures = more severe hurricanes. furthermore, you adimtted in a more recent post that the science of how global warming affects the weather is not set in stone, which of course contradicts your claim that the above bolded statement is proven science.

all i want you to do here is admit explicitly that which you have already admitted implicitly, and which should be obvious to anyone can read this with an even remotely objective mindset: that which you called "proven science" was no such thing.

[saltydawg]

what we have here is a case of you taking things at face value without considering the full implication.

you are correct that the study is very specific to the warmer waters near the u.s. that doesn't change the fact that it contradicts your categorical statement that higher near surface water temperatures = more severe hurricanes. furthermore, you adimtted in a more recent post that the science of how global warming affects the weather is not set in stone, which of course contradicts your claim that the above bolded statement is proven science.

all i want you to do here is admit explicitly that which you have already admitted implicitly, and which should be obvious to anyone can read this with an even remotely objective mindset: that which you called "proven science" was no such thing.

Sorry, higher near surface water temperatures = more severe hurricanes. Check out the physics of hurricanes.

[saltydawg]

Genesis 2:8 describes it as a particular place. Even if you assume that Eden was what God called the planet Earth, the Garden was a particular place in Eden.

Genesis 2:8
8 Now the LORD God had planted a garden in the east, in Eden; and there he put the man he had formed.

It doesn't say the Eden was a garden. It says that a garden was planted in Eden the terminology which gives further credence that Eden, itself, was a place on Earth otherwise he would have said a garden was planted on Eden.

Hmmm. Maybe we all are reading too much into the Scriptures. :icon_wink:

What I'm saying is that the Garden of Eden in Genesis is a metaphor for Earth. I guess i should add that Adam and Eve are a representative couple of our earliest ancestors.

[arkansasbob]

Sorry, higher near surface water temperatures = more severe hurricanes. Check out the physics of hurricanes.

read your own article. i'm getting tired of this. it may be time to bring back the silent bob avatar.